Transcript of Trump Manhattan Trial, May 10, 2024 (2024)

ProceedingsSUPREME COURTCRIMINAL TERMNEW YORK COUNTYPART 59THE PEOPLE OF THE STATE OF NEW YORK-againstDONALD J. TRUMP,Defendant.:3088INDICTMENT #71543/2023Falsifying BusinessRecords First DegreeBEFORE:100 Centre StreetNew York, New York 10013May 10, 2024HONORABLE JUAN M. MERCHAN,JUSTICE OF THE SUPREME COURTAPPEARANCES:FOR THE PEOPLE:ALVIN L. BRAGG, JR., ESQ.New York County District AttorneyBY: JOSHUA STEINGLASS, ESQ.,MATTHEW COLANGELO, ESQ.,SUSAN HOFFINGER, ESQ.,CHRISTOPHER CONROY, ESQ.,REBECCA MANGOLD,ESQ.,KATHERINE ELLIS, ESQ.,Assistant District AttorneysFOR THE DEFENDANT:BLANCHE LAWBY: TODD BLANCHE, ESQ.EMIL BOVE, ESQ.KENDRA WHARTON, ESQ.STEPHEN WEISS, ESQ.NECHELES LAW, LLPBY: SUSAN NECHELES, ESQ.GEDALIA STERN, ESQ.SUSAN PEARCE-BATESPrincipal Court ReporterLAURIE EISENBERG, RPR, CSRLISA KRAMSKYTHERESA MAGNICCARISenior Court ReportersLisa Kramsky,Senior Court Reporter

L234сл10M. Westerhout**-Cross/Necheles3089(The following proceedings were preceded by a sealedproceeding.)please.THE COURT: All right. Let's get the witness,THE COURT OFFICER: Witness entering.(The witness, Madeleine Westerhout, enters the78courtroom and resumed the witness stand.)610THE COURT: Good morning, Ms. Westerhout.You are reminded that you are still under oath.THE WITNESS: Yes.THE COURT: All right.Let's get the jury, please.THE COURT OFFICER: All rise. Jury entering.(Jury enters.)THE COURT: Please be seated.THE CLERK: Will both parties stipulate that alljurors present and properly seated?MR. STEINGLASS:MS. NECHELES:Yes.Yes.THE COURT: Good morning, jurors. Welcome back.11121314151617181920212223Counsel.2425MS. NECHELES: Thank you, your Honor.Lisa Kramsky,Senior Court Reporter

M. Westerhout-Cross/Necheles309012CONTINUED CROSS-EXAMINATIONBY MS. NECHELES:3Good morning.4AGood morning.56--7We spoke a little yesterday about the travel schedule.Do you recall thator I'm sorry, withdrawn.We spoke a little bit yesterday about the campaign?8AYes.910A11121314And you were working on the RNC Hearing; right?Yes.What is the RNC?A The Republican National Committee.And there came a point where President Trump won theRepublican nomination; right?15AYes.16And after that, am I correct, that the RNC and the17campaign worked extremely closely together?18AYes.192021Because at that point, President Trump is thepresumptive RepublicRNC wants, just like the campaign wants, to get him nominated;is the Republican nominee, and the22right?23AYes.2425AAbsolutely.So you guys were basically one unit; right?That's right.Lisa Kramsky,Senior Court Reporter

L23M. Westerhout-Cross/Necheles3091QAnd am I correct that everyday the RNC and the campaignwould jointly create a travel schedule or document that there45wasa travel schedule for President Trump?AWhenever the President-Elect was traveling, yes,10QAnd it would--so it included everything that he wasuh-huh.7 going to be doing on that day; correct?86AYes.QAnd I want to show you and the Prosecutors what hasbeen marked as L10Defendant's Exhibit L8 and L9.11(Displayed for the aforementioned parties only.)12MS. NECHELES: I apologize.I might not have set13this up.141516171819Q(Pause.)MS. NECHELES: Your Honor, if it's okay, I willcome back to it.THE COURT: Yes, of course.MS. NECHELES: We will come back to that.So I want you to look, then, at People's Exhibit 69 in20evidence.212223(Displayed.)Q And the Prosecutor asked you about this on direct; doyou recall that?24AYes.25And Rhona Graff gave you this list; right?Lisa Kramsky,Senior Court Reporter

LAYes.M. Westerhout-Cross/Necheles309223510And that was the list of contacts that Rhona Graff saidthat prior to the time that President Trump became President,that these were contacts he used in his business; right?AThat's right.Q And these are people that were personal friends and7 also business acquaintances, you know, that he worked with;8right?10AThat's right.And that's what Rhona Graff created for you; right?1011AYes.12131415A1617But there were many people on that list and, to yourunderstanding, is that these were people that President Trumpspoke to a lot before he became President; right?Spoke to before he became President or might beinterested in speaking to, to invite them to the White House orsomething.18Q And there were many people on that list who never19called the Oval Office; right?20AMany, yes.21222324That's correct.25And, to the best of your knowledge, there were manypeople on that list that President Trump never called while hewas in the Oval Office; right?AAnd I want to turn to People's Exhibit 70, which is anLisa Kramsky,Senior Court Reporter

M. Westerhout-Cross/Nechelesemail from you to Rhona Graff.123Sti4A5וס(Displayed.)3093And that was you sent that to Rhona Graff; right?Yes.And you were asking whether she could pass on anewspaper clipping; right?67AYes.8And if you turn to the next page, there is that9 newspaper clipping; right?10(Displayed.)11AYes.12MS. NECHELES: And if we could blow up the top13part.141516(Displayed.)Q It's a picture of the President the first time heboarded Air Force One; right?17AYes.18Kind of an exciting thing; right?19AYes.Exciting, yeah.20Q21AAnd he sent it to his family?Uh-huh.22Right?23AYes.2410Did he send that to a lot of people?25AYeah, uh-huh.Lisa Kramsky,Senior Court Reporter

LQ2AMQM. Westerhout-Cross/Necheles3094He was proud?He was. He was proud, yeah.And he would write a little note to the people on it;4right?5AUh-huh, yes.10Q And that was something that President Trump did a lot?7AYes.8610ASending newspaper clippings; right?Yes, quite often.And, in fact, you probably saw him do this thousands oftimes; right?1112AYes.1314Q He would send newspaper clippings of something thathappened to people that he knew; right?15AThat's right.16QAnd he would write a little note on them; right?17AYeah.18So, once he sent one to Allen Weisselberg; right?19AThat's right.20Like thousands of times he sent them to other people;21right?22AYes.23And you were asked on manyand so, when you were24asked on direct, you were asked the question whether it was not25unusual for him to have sent this newspaper clipping; do youLisa Kramsky,Senior Court Reporter

recall that?2AM. WesterhoutUh-huh, yes.-Cross/Necheles3095MWhat you meant by that was, it wasn't unusual for him4 to send them to everybody, newspaper clippings; right?510AThat's right.QBut with respect to sending them to Allen Weisselberg,7 do you recall what happened other times?8ANot that I can recall, no.QThis might have been the only time that he was10 President that he sent something like this to Allen Weisselberg;611right?12AIt could have been, yes.QAnd you were asked if Allen Weisselberg141513you spoke toAllen Weisselberg during when he was President; do you recallthat, about checks?16AYes.17And, am I correct, that you do not have any specific18recollection of Allen Weisselberg and the Presidentand19President Trump speaking during the first year that President20Trump was in office?21AThat's correct, yes.22232425Q And you have a vague recollection that at some pointthey might have spoken about a check?A Yes, vaguely, uh-huh.But you're not even sure that that's true; right?Lisa Kramsky,Senior Court Reporter

M. Westerhout-Cross/Necheles1ANo.2Q3And, in fact, you really don't recall any callsspecifically between him and Allen Weisselberg; right?4ANo. He spoke to so many people.5And I want to turn back to७3096MS. NECHELES: I think we're ready forto look789101112at the L8 and L9 for the witness and the parties only.(Displayed for the aforementioned parties only.)MS. MANGOLD: Your Honor, we object to this and weask to approach.THE COURT: Sure.(At Sidebar.)13**141516171819202122so much.exhibit.glue.THE COURT: Yes? I'm happy to get to see you all(Handed.)MR. STEINGLASS: We have several papers with thisI broke this again, Judge. I'm sorry.I think maybe some glue. I'm going to bring someTHE COURT: Good idea.23MR. STEINGLASS:I think that there are several24problems with this.25First of alland I think that this is unlikeLisa Kramsky,Senior Court Reporter

M. Westerhout-Cross/Necheles3097L2M4сл1078610some of the exhibits that the defense used oncross-examination because they were responsive.This is totally outside of the scope of the direct.And this is exactly the problem that we identified at thebeginning of this trial, which is, that they hadn'tdesignated any exhibits, and that your Honor had precluded--any exhibits that directed, you know, case in chiefexhibits that were not designated by the following day.They didn't designate any.So--and we specifically raised the spectre of thedefense trying to make our witnesses their own and back doorthat preclusion by trying to put in nonresponsive exhibits,11121314which are really case in chief exhibits, under the guisethat this is cross-examination.15Now, this is fully beyond the scope of the direct16examination.17We didn't ask a single question about the181920212223President's travel schedule or the President-Elect's travelschedule.And to top it all off, these travel scheduleexhibits are from October.She testified she wasn't even there at Trump Toweror working with the defendant until after Election Day.24So, this isthis should be precluded, this25entire area.Lisa Kramsky,Senior Court Reporter

M. Westerhout-Cross/Necheles3098L2M4сл10786MS. MANGOLD: I would just add to that, that shealso never testified that she worked on the travel schedule.She said that she scheduled things in Trump Tower.this?THE COURT: Ms. Necheles, what's the purpose ofMS. NECHELES: So, your Honor, we are just puttingit in evidence.We are not going through them.She testified on direct about his schedule, andthey have been talking about his schedule.We just are interested in what happens, actually,on one of those days, actually, October 26th.And this is a document that was created jointly bythe campaign and the RNC.She was working at the RNC that day.She received these documents every day at the RNC.On those days she received these every day when she was1011121314151617181920212223that one day2425working.And they were made and kept in the ordinary courseof business.THE COURT: What's the purpose of this?MS. NECHELES: It is to show what he was doing onTHE COURT: Why?MS. NECHELES:on October 26th.Lisa Kramsky,Senior Court Reporter

M. Westerhout-Cross/Necheles3099L2M4сл10786101112131415Because it's an issue in this trial in terms of thePeople are putting in phone documents about it, about whathappened, his conversations with Michael Cohen.Cohen.day?And this explains what he was doing with MichaelIt's one document, your Honor.THE COURT: I appreciate that, butMS. NECHELES:Yes.THE COURT: Why don't you just ask her about thatMS. NECHELES: What's the People's objection tothis document?THE COURT: Why don't you just ask: Do you knowdo you know what Donald Trump was doing on October 26th?MS. NECHELES: She doesn't recall.THE COURT: She doesn't?MS. NECHELES:Your Honor, but the business records.can establish it and she can establish this as a businessrecord.1617181920THE COURT:She wasthere at the time?21MS. NECHELES:Yes, she was there at the time. She22worked for the RNC.23THE COURT: Who created this?24MS. NECHELES:The RNC and the campaign jointly25created it.Lisa Kramsky,Senior Court Reporter

L234OTM. Westerhout-Cross/Necheles3100THE COURT: She didn't say that.MS. NECHELES: She will. I haven't been able toask her questions about it yet.THE COURT: You are getting close?MS. NECHELES: Yes, I haven't been able to ask her10about this yet.7We weren't able to put it up on the screen.I was86about to establish a business record foundation.That's what I'm doing, what I was going to do rightMR. STEINGLASS:This is exactly the problem.We did not ask a single question about schedulingor the work that she did prior to the election.Ms. Necheles asked about scheduling and meetings inthis isBut this door is not opened. This isvintage, and an end run around your Honor's ruling, and it10now.1112131415January.16171819202122232425should not be countenanced.MS. NECHELES: Judge, I have to say also, thesedocuments are not like a surprise to the People.They came to us in discovery.It's not like I'm showing documents that they havenever seen before.THE COURT: But the issue is whether you intendedto put them in all along.Lisa Kramsky,Senior Court Reporter

M. Westerhout-Cross/Necheles3101L234OT1078のMS. NECHELES: I actually just thought about thislast night.We never intended to put it in before. I thoughtof this last night.I never thought of putting it in before then.THE COURT: You need to lay a rock solidfoundation.If you can even lay the foundation for this,then I will allow it.But if you are unable to, then it's not coming in.1011MS. HOFFINGER:Those are ours.(Side bar concluded.)Thanks.12131415CONTINUED CROSS-EXAMINATIONBY MS. NECHELES:Ms. Westerhout, do you recognize that document in front16of you?17AI do, yes.18And arewere thoseis that a travel schedule that1920A2122was created by the Trump campaign and the RNC jointly?It appears to be, yes.And were those travel schedules created every day thatPresident Trump was traveling during the campaign?23AYes.24And were they shared with the RNC and the campaign?25AI believe so, yes.Lisa Kramsky,Senior Court Reporter

LQ2correct?34сл10M. Westerhout-Voir Dire/MangoldAnd you were working at the RNC at that point; am IAnd would you receive these travel schedules?AYes.AI don't believe I personally received them.Q But, would you see them?Probably, yes.31027A8And you saw them during the course of the--when you6were working at the RNC; right?10AYes.1112And when you say "probably," you are not sure whetheryou saw these exact ones; correct?13AThat's right, uh-huh.14QBut you saw the travel schedules on a regular basis;15right?16A1718Uh-huh, yeah.And you knew that they were created in the ordinarycourse of business of the RNC and the campaign; correct?19AYes.20And you knew that they were kept in the ordinary course21of business of the RNC and the campaign; right?22AThat's right.232425And it was the ordinary course of business for theRNC and the campaign jointly to create and keep these records;correct?Lisa Kramsky,Senior Court Reporter

M. Westerhout-Cross/Necheles31031AYes.2MS. NECHELES: I offer them in evidence, your3Honor.45MS. MANGOLD: May I voir dire, your Honor?THE COURT: Yes.678910VOIR DIRE EXAMINATIONBY MS. MANGOLD:Ms. Westerhout, do you have any specific recollectionof seeing these documents?11AUmm, yes.1213AThese particular documents in front of you?Yes. My lawyer showed it to me.14But,in--15A161718I'm sorry.During contemporaneously with the underlying eventsin October of 2016, do you have an independent recollection ofreceiving these personally?19ANo.202122When did your lawyer have you review these?And, please, when you answer, don't go into any discussionthat you had with your lawyer.23AThis morning.2425MS. MANGOLD: We object.THE COURT: Please approach.Lisa Kramsky,Senior Court Reporter

L2M. Westerhout(At Sidebar.)-Cross/Necheles3104M4сл10786right?THE COURT: So the People called this witness;I don't know how they got them this morning? Howdid they get them this morning?MS. NECHELES: I sent them this morning. I calledthem and then I sent it this morning.THE COURT: Because you intended to present it tothe witness?MS. NECHELES: It just happened that I thought ofit last night.MR. STEINGLASS:And we didn't even get notice ofthis until the witness was on the stand in the middle ofquestions.I mean, this is just sandbagging.1011121314151617181920212223foundation.2425MS. NECHELES: Judge, I just sent them this morningand then maybe ten minutes before I walked in here that Iwas able to talk to them.She did recognize many them. She said it.This is really a very last minute thing.THE COURT: But you were trying to lay aYou already knew that she didn't see this, and youalready knew her answer.Lisa Kramsky,Senior Court Reporter

M. Westerhout-Cross/Necheles3105L234сл107861011And this is not even your witness.MS. NECHELES:Your Honor, of course, I did.I, of course, I tried to present it to her.THE COURT: This is something that the People askedfor months before this trial, that you did not give noticeof, what the exhibits were that you were going to use.So for two reasons I'm keeping it out:Reason number one, you should have given it to thePeople. You did not present it to them prior to hertestifying.And, two, her answers are far from that which shecan establish this as a business record.I'm not allowing it in.MR. BOVE: Judge, may I respond on one issue?We are getting the flip side of this with exhibitsthat are being created and sent to us the night before.Judge, they are summarily giving us exhibits inthat way121314151617181920MR. BOVE:2122THE COURT: We can discuss that later.(Side bar concluded.)2324CONTINUED CROSS-EXAMINATION25BY MS. NECHELES:THE COURT: We can discuss that later.so it should be reciprocal.Lisa Kramsky,Senior Court Reporter

LQOkay.M. Westerhout-Cross/NechelesThanks.So I want to--3106234510678610THE COURT: I'm sorry, your motion to introducethis into evidence is denied.QMS. NECHELES: Thank you, your Honor.I want to turn your attention to the questions that youwere asked about checks,AUh-huh.All right. And you were asked a lot of questions abouthow checks were sent.Do you recall that?11AYes.121314And I want to show you what is Exhibit 66 in evidence.(Displayed.)MS. NECHELES: And that can be shown to everybody.15So this is an email chain about how--about addresses,16about how to send stuff to the White House; right?17AYes.181920MS. NECHELES: And if we can blow up the bottommost part, the bottom entry.(Displayed.)21222324MS. NECHELES: Thank you.And there were questions being asked about how tooh, that was John McEntee saying, "Can you put me in touch with25Rebecca because Keith is leaving and checks need to be sent toLisa Kramsky,Senior Court Reporter

1234him;" right?AM. Westerhout-Cross/NechelesCorrect.MS. MANGOLD:Objection.THE COURT:Overruled.31075Q And that occurred at some point along the lines when--you were sending you know, Keith Schiller was leaving the10678AYes.White House; right?6And I want to move a little bit back.1011MS. NECHELES:And wecan take that down.121314QAnd I want to move a little bit back to the first timewhen you started, when you got to the White House.And you said, yesterday, you didn't know anything when yougot there; right?15ANo.1617Q You had been working on the transition team, but therewas really no transition for you; right?18AThat's right.1920Q And you walked into the White House and you didn't knowhow President Trump would get personal items; right?21ANo, I did not.22QAnd you didn't know how his wife would get personal23items; right?24ANo.25And there was a lot of security about things that getLisa Kramsky,Senior Court Reporter

M. Westerhout-Cross/Necheles31081sent to the White House; wasn't there?2AYes.34And that includes checking any mail or items that getreceived; right?5AThat's right, uh-huh.67So at some point you were told that there was a PostOffice Box that had been set up for the President to get8personal items; right?9AThat's right.1011A1213And that was also true for the First Lady; correct?Yes.And then it turned out that that was a really a slowway to receive things; right?14AYes.15And because of the security; correct?16AYes, uh-huh.1718And am I correct that it was also slow because thingswould get lost; right?19AYeah, uh-huh.2021And that some people --sometimes you would find outthat things had been sent to the White House and thatPresident--for President Trump personally, and he neverreceived it; right?222324AYes, uh-huh.25And President Trump told you that friends of his wereLisa Kramsky,Senior Court Reporter

123M. Westerhout-Cross/Nechelesfeeling that he was being disrespectful to them; right?MS. MANGOLD: Objection.THE COURT:Sustained.3109Q Well, he was, President Trump was upset that he was not5 getting personal emails or personal information106--personaldocuments and letters from friends of his; right?7MS. MANGOLD:Objection.8ထ6THE COURT: Sustained.Q Well, wasn't that a problem, about getting mail to10 President Trump through the White House?11AYes.1213And he, President Trump, liked to return callspromptly, you testified yesterday?14AYes.1516And you testified yesterday that he felt like it wasdisrespectful if he didn't return calls promptly; right?17AYes.18MS. MANGOLD:Objection.192021QTHE COURT: Overruled.And so, you all tried to figure out a way that he couldget his mail promptly; right?22AThat's right.23And the same for the First Lady, that she could get24things promptly; right?25AThat's right.Lisa Kramsky,Senior Court Reporter

M. Westerhout-Cross/Necheles31101234And it was the same problem for Ivanka Trump, right,that she could get personal things promptly; right?A I don't have specific knowledge of Ms. Trump, butprobably.5And the idea was--had come up that things would be6sent to Keith Schiller?7AYes.8Right?9AYes.1011And that is how it came to be that Keith Schillerstarted to receive these checks personally; right?12AThat's right, yes.1314And when Keith Schillerthat was personal for President Trump; right?and he received other mail15ARight.1617And he also received things that were personal forMelania Trump; right?18AYes.1920A21Melania Trump?The First Lady; right.Because the First Lady also had the same problem;22right?23AYes.2425And then Keith Schiller would bring in these items andgive them to you; right?Lisa Kramsky,Senior Court Reporter

M. Westerhout-Cross/Necheles31111AThat's right.23A45And you would give them to President Trump; right?Yes.And when Keith Schiller left, it was transferred toanother person that the email got sent, that we just saw;6right?7AYes.8910A11And then when that other person left, it became yourjob; right?That's right.And that's what this whole testimony about Fed Ex12 packages was about; right?13AYes.1415It was a way that items could be sent to you and youcould get them promptly to President Trump; right?16171819202122AThat's right.And is it your understanding that this work-aroundexisted in prior administrations as well?MS. MANGOLD: Objection.THE COURT: Sustained.Well, wasn't it a new work-around that you all came upwith; was it?2324MS. MANGOLD:THE COURT:Overruled.Objection.25MS. NECHELES: Judge, can we approach?Lisa Kramsky,Senior Court Reporter

M. Westerhout-Cross/Necheles3112L234was it?Thank you.It wasn't a new work-around that you all came up with;Was it your understanding that this problem with getting5 items promptly to the President of the United States existed for10everybody who is in that Office?678MS. MANGOLD:Objection.Overruled.6THE COURT:A I don't have any knowledge of what it was like in10 previous administrations, but I can't imagine it would have beenany different.1112Now, when you received you know, just focusing13when you received whatever packages there was, you would give14them to President Trump or to the First Lady; correct?15AYes.16Q And you had nothing to do with giving documents or17packages to Ms. Trump, Ivanka Trump?18ANo, uh-uh.19QAnd do you know how she got them?20AUmmm, I don't.212223AAnd you would leave whatever items came for PresidentTrump on his desk; right?That's right.24And with respect to the checks, they came in a folder;25am I correct?Lisa Kramsky,Senior Court Reporter

L23M. WesterhoutAYes.And if you had---Cross/Necheles3113if he had the time when you gave themto him, he would sign them?4AYes. If he had the time and if he was in the office,5 yes.106QAnd you said he signed a tremendous amount of items;7right?8A6memos,Yes.And there were proclamations that he was signing?Yes, commissions, proclamations, executive orders,letters.And that would take up many hours of his day; right?Yes.Because he didn't not like to have that in printedform; right?He felt that if someone was getting his signature, theydeserved his real signature; right?Yes, absolutely.10A111213A141516ANo.171819A20212223QAnd2425MS. MANGOLD:Objection.THE COURT: Sustained.MS. MANGOLD: Move to strike.MS. MANGOLD: Move to strike.THE COURT: Stricken from the record.Lisa Kramsky,Senior Court Reporter

M. Westerhout-Cross/Necheles3114LQ And, were there times, you know, with all these--2 would you say it was hundreds of documents that he was signing?34ANot every day. But sometimes, uh-huh.5right?107And this was in between other things that he was doing;And so, would you see him signing things withoutA Oh, yes, uh-huh.8 reviewing them?6AYes.1011them?And would you see him signing checks without reviewing12AYes.1314Q And you would see him signing checks while he was onthe phone; right?15AYes.16Q17Would you see him sometimes signing checks when he wasmeeting with people?18AYes.1920Q And there were different types of people that he wasmeeting with; right?21AYes.22Q23Sometimes he was meeting with the top foreign leadersin the world; right?24AYes, uh-huh.25And other times he was meeting with you?Lisa Kramsky,Senior Court Reporter

L23M. WesterhoutAYeah, uh-huh.-Cross/Necheles3115And so, he wouldn't be signing the checks when he wasmeeting with the top people in the world?4AYes.510678Q But maybe when he was meeting with you, talking aboutsomething else, he would also be signing documents?A Yes, talking about the schedule or anything that hadbeen going on.10QThe Chief of Staff that he would be meeting with?10A11QYes.And other people, he would be doing that?12AThat's right.13Q14A151617181920He was a person who multitasked; right?Definitely.And now,we are showing.MS. NECHELES: If we could show Exhibit 71. Andthat's in evidence. People's Exhibit 71. We can show it toeverybody.(Displayed._I want to ask you about some other items that21And Madeleine Westerhout sent you this, right--oh,22you sent this to her and it says:"Rhona, can you help me with23this?"Right?24AYes.25And if we can turn to the next page. It's an invoice;Lisa Kramsky,Senior Court Reporter

M. Westerhout-Cross/Nechelesright?And this is a personal expense of President Trump;1right?2AYes.345A678AYes.910A11Right.And it was sent to you, and with the question fromRhona; right?31161213And she wanted to know what to do with this; right?Right.And in your experience, Rhona Graff was very carefulabout not wanting to spend the President's money without hisapproval; right?14AYes. Uh-huh.15And so she wanted to check with him; right?16AYes.17It's his money; right?18AYes.19And so,she would send you this kind of thing and ask20him?21A22Uh-huh, yes.And he answered it with one word; right?23ARight.24Just "pay;" right?25ARight.Lisa Kramsky,Senior Court Reporter

M. Westerhout-Cross/NechelesBoom! It was off his desk; right?Because he was extremely busy; right?12ARight.34AYes.15163117exhibit.And I want to turn your attention now to another7891011MS. NECHELES: I'm sorry, I just don't know theexhibit number.(Pause.)MS. NECHELES: People's Exhibit 75.(Displayed.)1213Yes. And do you recall being shown this on direct,14this is a series of emails about President Trump's--about a15frame that President Trump wanted?16AYes.1718And, again, Rhona Graff was asking questions about theprice of the frame; right?19ARight.20President Trump was21And just to be clear, this wasputting in the credenza, in back of where he sat, a number ofphotographs; right?2223AYes.242525And they were photographs of people who were importantto him; right?Lisa Kramsky,Senior Court Reporter

L2345M. Westerhout-Cross/Necheles3118AAcorrect?Yes, his family.He had a photograph of his father?Uh-huh.He had a photograph of his wife and children; is thatYes, uh-huh.And he wanted a photograph of his mother?10A78AYeah.And so he wanted a nice frame?10AThat's right.11QAnd those frames--those photographs, when he would be1012sitting at the Resolute Desk, they would be right behind him;13right?14AThat's right.151617A18And so,And often pictures that were taken would show thephotographs behind him; right?That's right, uh-huh.he was looking for a very nice frame; right?19AYes.20Q2122But Rhona Graff, again, was not comfortable spendingthe President's money; right?A To my understanding, yes.23And so you said on direct you made an executive24 decision to just okay this; right?25AYes. I don't remember specifically, but that couldLisa Kramsky,Senior Court Reporter

M. Westerhout1have very well been the case.2-Cross/Necheles3119Because when President Trump was in the White House,you understood he was too busy to be dealing with this kind ofthing; right?5AYes.10Q His life may have been different before when he was7 just running a major company in the United States, but it was8different when he was running the United States; right?610MS. MANGOLD:Objection.THE COURT: Overruled.11AThat's right.12Now, you were asked some questions about oryou13were in the White House, am I correct, when there camethere14was a story about Stormy Daniels; right?15AThat's right.1617Q And you were working with President Trump, very closelywith him at that point; right?18AYes.19QAnd did there come a time when there was a story about20Stormy Daniels in the paper?21AYes.2223Q And did you have a conversation with President Trumpabout that?24AYes, I did.25And based on that conversation, what was yourLisa Kramsky,Senior Court Reporter

M. WesterhoutRedirect/Mangold31201understanding of his feelings about this story?2AThat he was very upset by it.34A567891011121314151617And why?Ummm, my understanding is that he knew it would behurtful to his family.Q And that was based on what he said to you; was thatyour understanding?A Ummm, I don't believe he specifically said that, but Icould just tell that the whole situation was very unpleasant.MS. MANGOLD:Move to strike.THE COURT: Sustained.The answer is stricken.Well, when you say he didn't specifically say that, hespoke about his family?A Meaning, he didn't specifically speak about his familyin that conversation.Objection.1819Okay.MS. NECHELES:20212223If I may have a moment.(Defense counsel confer.)MS. NECHELES: I have no further questions.THE COURT: Any redirect?MS. MANGOLD:Yes, your Honor.2425REDIRECT EXAMINATIONLisa Kramsky,Senior Court Reporter

M. WesterhoutRedirect/Mangold31211BY MS. MANGOLD:23Good morning, Ms. Westerhout.AGood morning.4So, on cross-examination Ms. Necheles was just asking5 you about the method of sending checks via Fed Ex to the White10House; right?67AYes.861011And you testified that there were certain standardsecurity protocols in place at the White House where normalfor normal channels of mail?AYes.12Was the method of sending checks through Fed Ex tosomebody's personal address an end run around the White Housesecurity protocols?ANo. Not to my understanding, no. It was just a way toget things to him faster.Q And they wouldn't go through the typical screeningprocess for mail at the White House; right?That's right.13141516171819A2021222324AYes.25Now, you did not meet Mr. Trump for the first timeuntil after the election; right?AThat's right.And was that in November of 2016?And you testified on cross-examination that you reallyLisa Kramsky,Senior Court Reporter

M. WesterhoutRedirect/Mangold1had not spent any time with Mr. Trump until January of 2017;2right?3AYes, not a significant amount of time.31224And in the period of November 2016 through5 January 2017, in that transition period, you testified that you16worked out of Trump Tower?7AYes.89A1011Did you sit on a different floor from Mr. Trump?Yes.And did the RNC leadership in general sit on adifferent floor from Mr. Trump?12AYes.1314On cross-examination, Ms. Necheles didn't ask you ifyou had spoken to her before; right?15AShe did not.16Have you spoken to Ms. Necheles before?17AI have.18How many times?19AOnce.20And when did you last speak to her?21ATwo nights ago, Wednesday night.2223On cross-examination you told Ms. Necheles thatMr. Trump did not freak out about the Access Hollywood tape;24right?25AUhhhh. Did I? I don't recall saying that.Lisa Kramsky,Senior Court Reporter

M. WesterhoutRedirect/Mangold3123LQThe tape came out in October of 2016; right?2AYes.mQ And you did not meet Mr. Trump until after the election4 in November of 2016; right?5AThat's right.10Q And you didn't spend any real time with him until7 January 2017; right?8A Not a significant amount of time, yes.10QSo you have no firsthand knowledge about his reaction101112to the Access Hollywood tape; right?ANo firsthand knowledge, no.131415And you testified on cross-examination that whileserving as President, Mr. Trump signed commissionedproclamations, executive orders, memos and other documents;right?16AYes.17And it is your testimony that Mr. Trump signed those18documents without reviewing them?19ANot all of them. But, he had people who did that for20him that he trusted to prepare documents for his signature, so2122by the time they got to his desk, it was ready for hissignature.23Q And you testified on direct that you worked at a24 geopolitical consulting firm?25AYes.Lisa Kramsky,Senior Court Reporter

M. WesterhoutRecross/NechelesIs that American Global Strategies?12AYes.3St45וס3124Q And I think you testified that you are the Chief ofStaff for the Chairman?AYes.67AWho is the Chairman?Ambassador Robert O'Brien.8Was he the--was he President Trump's National9Security Advisor from 2019 to 2021?10AYes, he was.1112MS. MANGOLD: No further questions.THE COURT: Any recross?13MS. NECHELES:Yes, your Honor.14151617QRECROSS-EXAMINATIONBY MS. NECHELES:You were asked just whether you met with me prior to18this?19AYes.20QAnd we met for about an hour?21AThat's right.22By Zoom the other night?23AThat's right.2410Did you meet with the Prosecutor before this?25A I did.Lisa Kramsky,Senior Court Reporter

D. Dixon-Direct/Conroy1How many times?2AThree.34A5And when was the most recent time?Wednesday morning.And those were for hours?3125And just to reiterate, President Trump was very close16AYes.789to his family; right?AYes.10And it was your impression that he was very upset with11this all?12MS. MANGOLD:Objection.13THE COURT:Sustained.141516171819MS. NECHELES: No further questions, your Honor.THE COURT: Anything else?MS. MANGOLD: Nothing further, your Honor.Thank you.You can step down.(Witness excused.)202122232425THE COURT: People, your next witness?MR. CONROY: Judge, the People call Daniel Dixon.THE COURT OFFICER: Witness entering.(The witness, Daniel Dixon, entered the courtroomand stepped up to the witness stand.)Lisa Kramsky,Senior Court Reporter

L234От1078ထ6101112D. Dixon-Direct/Conroy*THE COURT OFFICER:Step to the other officer.3126Step this way, sir.THE WITNESS: Okay.THE COURT OFFICER: Step up here.Remain standing. And raise your right hand andface the court clerk.DANIELDIXON, a witness called on behalfof the People, having been first duly sworn was examined andtestified as follows:THE CLERK: Thank you.THE COURT OFFICER: Have a seat, please.Just state your first and last name, and spell yourTHE WITNESS: Daniel Dixon, D-I-X-O-N.THE COURT OFFICER: And your county of residence?THE WITNESS:Broward County, Florida.THE COURT: Good morning, Mr. Dixon.You may inquire.131415last name.161718192021MR. CONROY:22*23DIRECT EXAMINATION24BY MR. CONROY:25Thank you.Mr. Dixon, I'm just going to ask you if you can kind ofLisa Kramsky,Senior Court Reporter

D. Dixon-Direct/Conroy312712pull your chair in a little bit and speak into the microphone.Mr. Dixon, are you employed?3AYes.4Where do you work?5AAT&T.167A8And what kind of company is AT&T?Telecommunications company.And what is your job title there?9ALead Compliance Analyst.1011A121314How long have you been a Lead Compliance Analyst?Roughly six to seven years.What are some of your duties and responsibilities asLead Compliance officer?a10AI assist with complying with legal demands.1516171819I help analysts query records.And I also help with law enforcement interpreting ourrecords.In your role at AT&T, have you become familiar withAT&T's recordkeeping practices?20AYes.2122Do you understand that you are testifying today as acustodian of records for AT&T?23AYes.24Are you here because AT&T received a subpoena?25AYes.Lisa Kramsky,Senior Court Reporter

D. Dixon-Direct/ConroyDoes AT&T have counsel?Is that counsel here in the courtroom today?LQ2AYes.MQ4AYes.5106Related specifically to its phone business, does AT&Tkeep subscriber and call detail records?31287AYes.8What are6generally, what are call detail records?A Call detail records are the records for usage between adevice and another device.Q About how long does AT&T retain call detail records?10111213Q14AGenerally, three years.And when you say communication between a device andanother device, is that sort of phone calls between people?15AYes, mobility records.1617Q And could you tell us a little bit about whatsubscriber records are?18ASubscriber records is the customer information for the202119 account.Does AT&T make and keep these records in the regularcourse of its business?22AYes.2324Is it the regular course of AT&T's business to make andkeep these records?25AYes.Lisa Kramsky,Senior Court Reporter

D. Dixon-Direct/Conroy3129L234OT10Q Before testifying today, did you have opportunity toreview a thumb drive containing a set of electronic documents?AYes.MR. CONROY: Can I hand the witness a thumb drive.(Handed.)Is that the thumb drive that you reviewed?7AYes.86101112AHow do you know?It has my initials and the date.And does that thumb drive contain a set of AT&T recordsthat have been marked for identification as People'sExhibit 400?13AYes.1415Q Are the records contained in People's 400 foridentification call detail and subscriber records?16AYes.17How many different phone numbers do they relate to?18ASix numbers that belong to AT&T and eleven numbers thatwere just on our network for roaming or was in contact with an1920AT&T number.21QOkay. So there are records22tell me if I get thisright. There are records for 17 different phone numbers?--23AYes.24QOf which six belong to customers of AT&T?25AYes.Lisa Kramsky,Senior Court Reporter

D. Dixon-Direct/ConroyL234Q And the other eleven are just call records that AT&Tcaptured because it used the AT&T system?ACorrect.Were those records for the non-AT&T customer records,5 do those call detail records only reflect calls that weretransmitted through AT&T cell towers or calls made to or106received from an AT&T customer?78AYes.31301010Do all of these phone records, both the subscriber andthe call detail records, relate to the general time period of2015 to 2018?1112AYes.131415Q Did AT&T make and keep this subscriber and call detailrecords contained in People's 400 for identification in theregular course of its business?16AYes.17Was it the regular course of AT&T's business to make18and keep these particular records?19AYes.20QAre the entries made on these documents made at the21time that the recorded events or transactions took place orwithin a reasonable time thereafter?2223AYes.2425QIs the data contained in these reports captured throughan automated process and stored in an electronic database?Lisa Kramsky,Senior Court Reporter

L23AYes.D. Dixon-Direct/ConroyDoes AT&T rely on the accuracy of that automatedprocess and the access to that database?31314AYes.5And can AT&T employee capture data from the electronicdatabase, and are they under a business duty to do so10678AYes.accurately?61011MR. CONROY: Judge, at this point, I would offerthis as People's 400.MR. BOVE: No objection.12THE COURT:People's 400 is accepted into evidence.13(So marked in evidence.)14***1516MR. CONROY: And just, just for the record, this issubject to the Sealing Order that was dated April 19th.17THE COURT:Okay.1819MR. CONROY: Now, if we could pull up three pagesfrom this exhibit that have been redacted.20And beginning with page--with Bates stamp DANY212223GJ and then 60 and the number 38.(Displayed.)Do you recognize this?24AYes.25What is this?Lisa Kramsky,Senior Court Reporter

D. Dixon-Direct/Conroy3132A A subscriber report.Is this a representative sample of an AT&T subscriber12Q3record?4AYes.516Do the pages you are viewing on the screen containredactions?7AYes.89Did you have a chance to compare the redacted pagesthat we see here to the original pages that are not redacted,but that are in evidence as People's 400?101112AYes.Were the redacted and unredacted pages the same, but13for the redactions?14AYes.15I just want to ask you about a few of the boxes in16here.17What does "financially liable party" mean?18A19It's the person responsible for paying the bill.What is the billing party?202122A The billing party is where the bill is mailed to.MR. CONROY: And if we could pull up the userinformation.23(Displayed.)24AThat's the registered user for the account.25So is itcould it be different--could the billingLisa Kramsky,Senior Court Reporter

12D. Dixon-Direct/Conroyparty be different from the user information?AYes.313334AWhy is that?Because the person who pays the bill is not necessarily5 the one using the phone number.10Q Is that something you might often see in a situation678AYes.where a business gives phones to employees?6Q So the business might be the billing party, but the10 individual employee who uses the phone might be in the user11 information?12AYes.13QWhat is the MSISDN?14AThat's the phone number on the account.15And what does "MSISDN Active" mean?16AThe date it was active.17So, it's sort of a date range?18AYes,a date range.19MR. CONROY: If we could take that down.20And if we could--I want to pull up now an21example of call detail records.22(Displayed.)23Q24Do the call detail records within People's Exhibit 400contain three different types of reports?25AYes.Lisa Kramsky,Senior Court Reporter

D. Dixon-Direct/Conroy313412A34150167What are those three reports?Mobility, wireline, and international.Starting with mobility.What is a mobility report?A Mobility is the communication between a mobile andany mobile device and a mobile device, two mobile devices.Q So a phone call from a cell phone to a cell phone?What is "International"?8AYes.910101112AThat's when the international network was used to makeor help receive a phone call.And what is wireline?Wireline is the use of AT&T's wireline-side of thenetwork to help make or receive a phone call.13A1415QIs that sometimes called hardline?16AI'm sorry?17Is that sometimes called hardline? Or is that18A192021Yes. Landline.Landline, sorry. That's what I meant, landline.Is the mobility report further subdivided into differentcategories of data?22AYes.2324And do those include invoice usage, data usage, SMSusage and SMS email usage?25AYes.Lisa Kramsky,Senior Court Reporter

D. Dixon-Direct/Conroy313512A345ACan you briefly describe what invoice usage means?Invoice usage shows the transactional logs betweenphone calls.What does SMS usage mean?That also shows the transactional logs between text6messages.7QDoes8encrypted apps?would that include text messages made through9ANo.10Do they include iMessages?11ANo.12131415Generally speaking, for the two iPhone users that aremessaging one another, would you expect to see thosetransactions in the call detail records?A It would be a transaction that's captured in a data16session.17In a data session?18AA data session, yes.19And when you--what does that mean? Can you explain202122232425what that means?A So, on our data records, we show logs of differentsessions.Just a length of the session, we are unable to determinewhat took place during those sessions.Okay. And, actually, the next thing we are going toLisa Kramsky,Senior Court Reporter

D. Dixon-Direct/Conroy3136123talk about is, what does data usage mean.What are some of the types of activity that would becaptured in a data usage report?4AStreaming movies.Anything related to the internet.567And when you look at a data usage report, do you justsee amounts of data that was used, or do you see what that datawas used to do?8AOnly amounts of data being used.91011So, you have no way of understanding, you just knowX amount of data was used, but you don't know if somebody wasstreaming a movie or iMessaging or something else?12ACorrect.1314ACan you briefly tell us what SMS email usage means?SMS email is just basically a text to or from an email151617address.For all of the different types of call detail recordsyou just described, what time zone are AT&T's records recorded18in?19AUTC.2021A22And what is UTC?Universal Time Coordinated.And is that true for all types of AT&T records?23AYes.24MR. CONROY: If we could now pull up another25redacted page from this exhibit.Lisa Kramsky,Senior Court Reporter

D. Dixon-Direct/Conroy31371And this page bears Bates stamp DANY GJ 00002822.2QMr. Dixon, is this a representative sample of an AT&T3invoice usage record?4AYes.59A101112And I just want to ask you about a few of the columns.6 What does "CONN" stand for?78AConnection.And what is Seizure Time?"Seizure Time" is the moment a person hits call upuntil the recipient answers the phone.And are both Connection and Seizure Time in UTC, as wejust discussed?13AYes. The connection times is a timestamp.14What is "ET?"15A"ET" is the length of the connection.1617A18And does "ET" stand for elapsed time?Elapsed time.And is that in minutes and seconds?19AYes.20212223mean?What does originating number and terminating numberA That means, originating is who made the call.Terminating is who received the call.24Is one single phone call sometimes reflected on more25than one row in the call detail records?Lisa Kramsky,Senior Court Reporter

D. Dixon-Direct/Conroy31381AYes.2(Whereupon, at this time, Principal Court34Reporter Susan Pearce-Bates relieved Senior CourtReporter Lisa Kramsky as the official court reporter.)51678910111213141516171819202122232425Lisa Kramsky,Senior Court Reporter

D. Dixon-Cross/Bove3139123A4567purposes.(Continued from the previous page.)Could you briefly explain why that is?So, these reports are used for network and billingThey show the raw records, how that call flowsthrough the network.Q So, if it had more than one entry, would that justmean it hit different parts of the network while the call was8going on?9A101112Correct.MR. CONROY: I have no further questions.THE COURT: Your witness.MR. BOVE: Thank you, Judge.1314THE COURT:You may inquire.MR. BOVE:Thank you.15CROSS-EXAMINATION16BY MR. BOVE:1718192021Good morning, Mr. Dixon.My names is Emil Bove and I represent President Trump,who is over here to the left.I just want to talk in a little bit more detail aboutsome of the records we just covered to make sure I understand22them.23AOkay.2425I would like to start with the subscriber record.MR. BOVE: And, Mr. Bernik, if we can bring upSusan Pearce-Bates, RPR, CCR, RSAPrincipal Court Reporter

D. Dixon-Cross/Bove314012the same page that the Government had up from Government'sExhibit 400 with Bates ending 038.3Can we ask the Government to bring up that page?4If you canzoom in, please, on the box that has5the MSISDN.७789Thank you.Q So, Mr. Dixon, in the top left, that is MSISDN, whichis the phone number you said?AYes.101112A1314To the right of that cell it says, IMSI.Do you see that?Yes.And that stands for International Mobile SubscriberIdentity, right?15AYes.16And the IMSI is linked to an AT&T's user account,17right?18AWell, it's the serial number of a SIM card.192021A2223Right. So, it is a SIM card that is linked to theAT&T account that we are looking at?At that time, yes.And a SIM card can be pulled out of one phone, onedevice, and put into another, correct?24AYes.25And so, this IMSI is not necessarily linked to aSusan Pearce-Bates, RPR, CCR, RSAPrincipal Court Reporter

D. Dixon-Cross/Bove1 particular physical device, right?31412ACorrect. It can be taken out.It's just the serial3number of a SIM card.4MR. BOVE:If we can zoom in on status changes5678there at the bottom, please.Q Mr. Dixon, I wanted to ask about the cells that readXMKT Move.Do you see that?9AYes.10And that means that that is a cross market move,11right?12A13141516A171819I believe so.That is a situation where the user's accounttransitions from one account number to another within AT&T'srecords, right?Usually, yes.So, here this record indicates that on January 23,2017, this was a cross market move associated with this MichaelCohen account?20AYes.2122And so, for the record that we are looking at, thisuser account, the subscriber information begins January 23,232017?24ACan you repeat that?25Because of the cross market move field that we areSusan Pearce-Bates, RPR, CCR, RSAPrincipal Court Reporter

D. Dixon-Cross/Bove314212looking at, what that suggests is that the subscriberinformation we are looking at begins on that period?34is567Q8910A1112A--the status change history only shows changes of theaccount. So, it could have been created before and somethingtook place on January 23, 2017.Right. The account could have been created before andthen the phone number transitioned onto this account by a crossmarket move?Possibly.Do you want to look at a different piece of this pageto try to figure that out?We would have to look in the other boxes because this1314ACould you zoom back out?So, it was--it would seem as if on January 23rd, the151617181920number left this account.MR. BOVE: And if we can zoom back in on thatbox, please.Thank you.Do you see that the top two rows, contract acceptedand contract acceptance required?2122AYes.What does that indicate?23A2425I am not familiar with it.MR.BOVE: Now, we can take that down.Thank you.Susan Pearce-Bates, RPR, CCR, RSAPrincipal Court Reporter

D. Dixon-Cross/Bove3143records.I want to talk a little bit about the AT&T billingAnd those are, basically, records of calls involvingthis phone number over AT&T's network, right?12345AYes.678A9101112And you can't tell from the records themselves whoactually spoke, right?Correct.And, obviously, these records don't reflect thecontents of the calls, right?ACorrect.And you are familiar with the concept of a pocket13 dial, right?141516ACorrect.So, it's possible that that could happen, somebodypicks up the phone, the phone gets picked up on the other endbut there is no communication, right?In these records, there is a lot of data here, but thedata also has limits, right?1718AYes.192021222324AYes.25A It's showing the transactional logs.Transactional logs meaning the amount of time that theone phone number was connected to the other, right?And also that period of time where the one phoneSusan Pearce-Bates, RPR, CCR, RSAPrincipal Court Reporter

D. Dixon-Cross/Bove31441number was dialing the other?2AYes.34567MR. BOVE: And if we can bring up the redactedmobility logs that we were looking at.there?Thank you.You see on the right side there is a column, IMEI on8A910A11Yes.That's International Mobile Equipment Identity, right?Yes.And that is, actually, a number that is linked to a12 physical device, right?13AYes.14So that IMSI, travels with a SIM card you pulled out1516from another phone, right?AYes.But on this record, where is says IMEI on it, that isa specific reference to a particular phone, correct?A device, yes.MR. BOVE: There is one unredacted page that Iwould like to show just the witness, Judge, if that is all171819Α202122right.232425THE COURT: Sure.MR. BOVE: So, Mr. Bernik, this is for theparties, the Court and the witness, part of GovernmentSusan Pearce-Bates, RPR, CCR, RSAPrincipal Court Reporter

D. Dixon-Cross/Bove31451Exhibit 400 that ends with Bates 1093, please.23Q And I just want to make sure that I understand theFeature column, and so, we are going to go through a couple of4these, and I am going over to the table so I can see as well.5MR. BOVE: And so, let's--if we could zoom in७on the Feature column for item seven and eight on this7page.8And, Mr. Dixon, while we are doing that, are you9 familiar with the codes in the Feature column?10AYes.11And so, do you see where it says, NIOP?12AYes.13And that's Call Number Identity Presentation, right?14AYes.1516A17Basically an incoming call?Correct.And then do you see where it says, CFNA?18AYes.19Calling Number Identity Presentation, right?20ANo. CFNA is Call Forwarding No Answer.21And then the next one is VM, Voice-mail?22AYes.232425So, am I understanding this right, that when I seesomething like this in the Feature column, what I am looking atis a call that is dialed and then it goes to voicemail, right?Susan Pearce-Bates, RPR, CCR, RSAPrincipal Court Reporter

D. Dixon-Cross/Bove31461AYes.2And in the AT&T records, each account has a separate3phone number for voicemail, right?4A Not each account, but each voicemail magistrate.So,5there is another number entailed with voicemail.Was it voicemail magistrate that you said?7A8910Voicemail box.And so,that an incoming call to the number associatedwith this account, again, gets forwarded to that voice-mailinbox, right?11AYes.12131415Q16A17MR. BOVE: Now, if we can stay on these two rows,items seven and eight, and if you can zoom in onOriginating Number and Terminating Number.And so, you see here there is a D in parentheses?Yes.That stands for dialed, right?18AYes.1920And so, there is an originating number that dialedthat 0114 number, right?21AYes.2223AAnd then where you see the F in parenthesesYes.24--that is the number getting forwarded to the25voicemail inbox, correct?Susan Pearce-Bates, RPR, CCR, RSAPrincipal Court Reporter

ProceedingsAnd that's what the F means?1AYes.23AYes.45163147witness?MR. BOVE: I have nothing further, Judge.THE COURT: Any redirect?MR. CONROY: I have nothing, Judge.Thank you.THE COURT:Thank you, sir.You can step down.(Witness is excused.)THE COURT: Would you like to call your nextMR. CONROY: Yes, Judge.At this time the People call Jennie Tomalin.COURT OFFICER: Witness entering.(Whereupon, the witness entered thecourtroom.)COURT OFFICER: Good morning.Step up. Remain standing, please.Raise your right hand and face the Clerk.THE CLERK: Do you solemnly swear or affirm thatthe testimony you are about to give before this Court willbe the truth, the whole truth and nothing but the truth?THE WITNESS:Yes, I do.THE CLERK: Thank you.78910111213141516171819202122232425Susan Pearce-Bates, RPR, CCR, RSAPrincipal Court Reporter

12345७J. Tomalin Direct/Conroy3148COURT OFFICER: State your full name and spellyour last name.THE WITNESS: It's Jennie Tomalin, T-O-M-A-L-I-N.COURT OFFICER: Your county of residence.THE WITNESS: Mercer County.THE COURT: Good morning.7You may inquire.8JENNI ETO MALIN,109called as a witness on behalf of the People, being first dulysworn by the Clerk of the Court, was examined and testified as11follows:12QGood morning, Ms. Tomalin.13Are you employed?14AYes, I am.15Where do you work?16AVerizon.17What kind of company is Verizon?18AWe are a telecommunications company.1920A21What is your job title?I am a Senior Analyst in Executive Relations.How long have you been in that role?22ASince 2017; so, seven years.232425role?And what are your duties and responsibilities in thatA My duties include appearing in court as a custodian ofSusan Pearce-Bates, RPR, CCR, RSAPrincipal Court Reporter

J. TomalinDirect/Conroy31491records to testify to records previously produced in response2to subpoenas, court orders and search warrants.3What did you do at Verizon before you were in that4role?5AI was167Q8A910a Subpoena Compliance Coordinator of the VerizonSecurity Assistance Team.How long have you been at Verizon?Eighteen years.And in your time at Verizon, have you become familiarwith Verizon's recordkeeping practices?11AYes, I have.1213asAnd you understand that you are here today testifyinga custodian of records for Verizon?14AYes, I do.1516And are you here because Verizon received a subpoenaasking for custodian testimony?17AYes, I am.181920A2122ARelating, specifically, to its phone business, doesVerizon keep subscriber and call records?Yes, we do.Generally, what are call records?Call records for the wireless side are billable23 incoming and outgoing calls. On the wired-line side, call24records will be tolls or billable outbound calls.25Q And what are subscriber records?Susan Pearce-Bates, RPR, CCR, RSAPrincipal Court Reporter

J. Tomalin Direct/Conroy1234A3150Records that contain the financial responsible partyfor the line of service or account, including any contactinformation, address, et cetera.Does Verizon make and keep subscriber and call records5 in the regular course of its business?16AYes, we do.789And is it the regular course of Verizon's business tomake and keep such records?AYes, it is.10111213MR. CONROY: I am going to ask that the witnessbe handed a thumb drive.Thank you.Ms. Tomalin, if you take a look at that thumb drive,14does that thumb drive contain a set of Verizon records that1516A1718have been marked for identification as People's Exhibit 401?Yes, it does.And before coming to court today, did you have achance to review the records on that thumb drive?19AI did.20And is that the thumb drive you reviewed?21AYes, it is.2223A2425How do you know that?Because I initialed and dated the thumb drive.Are the records contained in People's 401 foridentification on that thumb drive call and subscriber records?Susan Pearce-Bates, RPR, CCR, RSAPrincipal Court Reporter

J. TomalinDirect/Conroy31511AYes, they are.23A45How many different phone numbers do they relate to?Twelve.Do those phone numbers all belong to Verizoncustomers?AYes.78Do all of the phone records, both subscriber and callrecords, relate to the general time period of 2015 to 2018?9AYes.10111213Did Verizon make and keep the subscriber and callrecords contained in People's Exhibit 401 for identification inthe regular course of its business?14AYes.Was it the regular course of Verizon's business to15make and keep these particular records?16AYes.171819Are the entries made on these documents made at thetime of the recorded events or transactions took place orwritten a reasonable time thereafter?20AYes.21222324Is the date contained in these reports capturedam sorry. Is the data contained in these reports capturedthrough an automated process and stored in the electronicdatabase?25AYes.Susan Pearce-Bates, RPR, CCR, RSAPrincipal Court ReporterI

J. TomalinDirect/Conroy315212Does Verizon rely on the accuracy of that automatedprocess and electronic database?3AYes.45 from the electronic database?Can Verizon employees run reports that capture data16AYes.7Are they under a business duty to do so accurately?8AYes.910MR. CONROY: At this point I am going to offerPeople's Exhibit 401 into evidence.1112MR. BOVE: No objection.THE COURT:It's accepted into evidence.13(Whereupon, People's Exhibit 401 is received into14evidence.)15MR. CONROY: If we can now pull upI think I16171819202122am running a little behind here. If we can pull up aredacted page from one of the call records.Displayed in front of you and for the room is aredacted page from People's 401 which bears the Bates stampDANY GJ, triple 0, 64777.Is this a representative sample of a call record for aVerizon phone number?23AYes, it is.2425Does this page that we are looking at containredactions?Susan Pearce-Bates, RPR, CCR, RSAPrincipal Court Reporter

J. TomalinDirect/Conroy3153Did you have a chance to compare this redacted page to1AYes, it does.2Q345AYes, I did.the original page that is part of what's in evidence asPeople's 401?७7A8910111213But for the redactions, are the pages identical?Yes.Could you just walk us through the columns on thispage and explain what each one is?AYes. Starting on the left, the Date column identifiesthe date that the call began.The Time column identifies the time the call began.The Number column will identify the telephone numberthat the target telephone number was communicating with.The Rate and Usage Type columns identify what portionof a customer's calling plan will be applied to these calls.The Origination column identifies the geographicalarea for which we are billing the target telephone number whilemaking or receiving the telephone call.1415161718192021The Destination Call Logs for FM calls, identified bythe home area of the telephone number being called.222324For Incoming Calls it will reflect incoming CL or anyother code that is needed with that call.The Min column, identifies the length of the call in25minutes.Susan Pearce-Bates, RPR, CCR, RSAPrincipal Court Reporter

J. Tomalin-Cross/Bove315412345וס6A78910A1112Air Time Charges, Long Distance/Other Charges andTotal, those three columns identify any financial chargesassessed to that call respectively.Just a couple of quick questions.In the MIN column, is that minutes?Yes, it is.And how does that work?Does it reflect seconds, or does Verizon round in astandard direction?On the bill we round up.And with respect to the time shown for each of thosecalls, what timezone does Verizon keep its records in?13ATheythe timezone should be the timezone for the14City and State reflected in the origination column.15Q16So, when we look at the date and time columns,together with the origination column, that should tell us the17timezone that that call is being reflected in?18AYes.192021222324MR. CONROY: Thank you.I have no further questions.THE COURT: You may inquire.MR. BOVE: Thank you, Judge.CROSS-EXAMINATIONBY MR. BOVE:25QGood morning, Ms. Tomalin.Susan Pearce-Bates, RPR, CCR, RSAPrincipal Court Reporter

J. Tomalin-Cross/Bove3155My name is Emil Bove and I represent President Trump,1AGood morning.2345who is over here on my left.I want to talk a little lit about the subscriberrecords that are part of Exhibit 401 if we could.७AYes.789101112QMR. BOVE: Because they are not redacted, I amjust going to askTHE COURT: Sure.MR. BOVE: So, Mr. Bernik, this is just for theCourt, the parties and the witness.Take a look at the spreadsheet with Bates ending1364591.14And Ms. Tomalin, do you see that in Column D it says,15MTN?16A17Yes.That's Mobile Telephone Number in Verizon records,18right?19AYes.20The phone number linked to the account, correct?21AYes.22And so,23if you look at cell D3, Column D, row three,that row relates to telephone number ending 5361?24AYes.25And if you look, staying on that row, at Columns F andSusan Pearce-Bates, RPR, CCR, RSAPrincipal Court Reporter

12J. Tomalin-Cross/Bove3156G, the subscriber name is Keith Davidson linked to this number?AYes.34So that when you say, subscriber name, that'sinformation that somebody provided to Verizon saying that I am5 a person who is linked to this account, right?७AYes.789MR. BOVE: And Mr. Bernik, if we could scrollover to Column AA, please.Do you see where it says, MTN Effective Date?10AYes.1112right?So, that's a Mobile Telephone Number Effective Date,13A1415Correct.That indicates the date on which this phone number waslinked to the account, right?16AThat's right.1718So, for this row, what does it say for this row?I am sorry. I can't see.19AThat was row three, correct?20Yes.Thank you.21AApril 30, 2010.222324So, for this record, as of April 30, 2010, goingforward, this number was linked to the particular accountthat's reflected in this subscriber information, right?25ACorrect.Susan Pearce-Bates, RPR, CCR, RSAPrincipal Court Reporter

Colloquy3157And for purposes of this record, prior to April of2010, this record doesn't have anything to say about that,123correct?4A516Correct.And phone numbers can shift from account to accountand person to person, right?7AYes.8And so, you know, it's entirely possible that9 pre-April 2010, this number belonged to somebody else, right?10AYes.111213I just I have one question about the toll recordsthat we looked at in Government Exhibit 401. Those sorts oflooked like the phone bills that I might get for my cellphone,14right?15AYes.16And you said Verizon rounds up on the Duration field?17AYes.1819So, if there was a call that lasted 15 seconds, doesthat bump up to one minute?20AYes.2122And if a call lasted one second, it bumps up to oneminute also?23AYes.24MR.25BOVE: Thank you.THE COURT:Anything else?Susan Pearce-Bates, RPR, CCR, RSAPrincipal Court Reporter

ColloquyTHE COURT: Thank you.31581MR. CONROY:No, Judge.2345७You may step down.THE WITNESS: Thank you.(Whereupon, the witness is excused.)THE COURT: All right, jurors. Let's take ourmorning recess.78Please remember my admonitions.See you in a few9minutes.1011121314151617181920this time?COURT OFFICER: All rise.(Whereupon, the jury exited the courtroom.)THE COURT: You may be seated.People, is there anything you want to discuss atMR. STEINGLASS: No. We have to modify theexhibit as we discussed before.THE COURT: I believe there was also an objectionfrom the Defense.MR. BOVE: Yes, Judge.THE COURT: Is this a good time to take up the21objection?22MR. BOVE: Yes, your Honor.23THE COURT: Let's do that.2425MR. BOVE: So, Government Exhibit 411, it wouldbe 411-B is the proffered exhibit, is an excerpt of--anSusan Pearce-Bates, RPR, CCR, RSAPrincipal Court Reporter

ColloquyPresident Trump by Larry King in 1999.31591excerpt of an--excuse me, excerpt of an interview of2345७78910111213141516171819202122232425And, in substance, there is a question, what areyour views on campaign finance reform?And part of what President Trump said in responseto that in 1999 is that he is very experienced with thecampaign finance laws, and I think the clip is limited tojust about that.Our position is that that is not relevant withrespect to President Trump's state of mind in 2016 and 2017because there has been extensive revisions to the campaignfinance laws in the intervening period, both statutory andin the Supreme Court.Whatever President Trump may have said in 1999about his knowledge of the campaign finance laws is notprobative of his state of mind in 2016 and 2017.MS. MANGOLD: Your Honor, we disagree. We thinkthat Defendant's admission that he has extensive knowledgeof campaign finance laws is obviously directly relevant tothe case.We understand that there were, as Mr. Bove noted,extensive changes to campaign finance laws in 2002. Webelieve that's a reference to the McCain/Feingold Act.However, the separate contribution ban, which isthe one that's relevant here, has been part of campaignSusan Pearce-Bates, RPR, CCR, RSAPrincipal Court Reporter

Colloquy316012finance laws since 1907, so close to 90 years beforeMr. Trump made the admission in that video.3And to the extent that defense counsel argues4that the clip predates the relevant time period, that's an5issue that goes to weight and not admissibility.167THE COURT: Do you have any other argument?MR. BOVE:No.That's our position, Judge.8910111213141516171819202122THE COURT: All right.I will rule after the break.(Short recess is taken.)SERGEANT: Remain seated. Come to Order.Part 59 is back in session.THE COURT: All right.Two things regarding the People's application, Iunderstand what you are saying, that the laws did notchange between 1999 and 2017. I still feel that that'spretty attenuated.Plus, you are asking the jurors to draw aninference that because he knew the laws in 1999, he stillknew them in 2015 and 2017. I think that's a lot ofspeculation.I am going to side with the Defense and precludeyou from introducing that.Regarding scheduling today, we have two more232425witnesses, right, today?Susan Pearce-Bates, RPR, CCR, RSAPrincipal Court Reporter

Colloquy31611MR. STEINGLASS:Yes.THE COURT: And how long do you expect thewitnesses to be?2345total.MS. MANGOLD: I think we probably have an hour in1678THE COURT: In total?MS. MANGOLD: In total.THE COURT:So,are we okay working until one9101112131415161718192021o'clock, or maybe a little bit longer than one o'clock, sowe will end in the morning and not come back in theafternoon?MR. BLANCHE: Yes, your Honor.MS. MANGOLD: Yes.MR. STEINGLASS: Your Honor, I have a legalmatter about an exhibit that we can take up after thewitnesses are done.I don't think it will take long.THE COURT: Let's get the jury, please.SERGEANT: All rise, jury entering.(Whereupon, the jury entered the courtroom.)THE COURT: You may be seated.22THE CLERK:Case on trial continued.23All jurors are present and properly seated.24THE COURT:Jurors, before we call the next25witness, I wanted to talk about the schedule for the restSusan Pearce-Bates, RPR, CCR, RSAPrincipal Court Reporter

G. Longstreet-Direct/Mangold31621of the day.23I am told that we only have two more witnessesthat are relatively short. Today's plan is we are going to4work until about one o'clock or whatever time we get done5so you don't have to come back in the afternoon.16Let's call the next witness, please.7MS. MANGOLD:The People recall Georgia8Longstreet.910(Whereupon, the witness resumed the stand.)THE COURT: Ms. Longstreet, you are still under11oath.121314LONG STREET,151617181920A2122GEORGIAYou may inquire.MS. MANGOLD: Thank you, your Honor.called as a witness, being previously sworn, was examined andtestified further as follows:Welcome back, Ms. Longstreet.Can you remind everyone where you work and what yourposition is?Yes. I work for the New York County DistrictAttorney's Office, and I am a paralegal.The last time you were here, I believe you testifiedthat your duties and responsibilities include locating and2324saving social media posts relevant to the case?25AYep.Susan Pearce-Bates, RPR, CCR, RSAPrincipal Court Reporter

1234567G. Longstreet-Direct/Mangold3163Is that your primary job function, or do you have manyother duties and responsibilities in addition to that one?A Many other duties and responsibilities.Do your other duties and responsibilities includeanalyzing materials produced to the District Attorney's Officein response to subpoenas?AYes.89Does that include analyzing records of communicationslike text messages and call messages?10AYes.1112A1314Does that include analyzing contact information?Yes.Does it include matching contact information to textand call records?15AYes.161718Do your duties and responsibilities also includelocating and reviewing filings from other court proceedingsthat may be relevant to this case?19AYes.2021And do they also include keeping track of key eventsrelated to the case?22AYes.2324Now, you previously testified that you were assignedto work on a matter involving Donald Trump about a year and a25half ago, right?Susan Pearce-Bates, RPR, CCR, RSAPrincipal Court Reporter

G. Longstreet-Direct/Mangold31641AYep.23A45capacity?Are you the only paralegal who works on this matter?I am not.Who else works on the matter with you in the paralegal6AThere are two other paralegals, Nishant Bhaumik and789Jaden Jarmel-Schneider.In addition to your own work, are you familiar withthe work done by the other paralegals on the case?10AYes.11121314AHow are you familiar with that?I like to think we all work as one. We all kind of dothe same things.And do you know what work they do in addition to your15own?16A17181920Yep.As part of your role on the matter involving DonaldTrump, are you, Mr. Bhaumik and Mr. Jarmel-Schneiderresponsible for reviewing materials produced to the DA's Officein response to subpoenas?21AYes.2223And does that include analyzing records ofcommunications like text messages and phone calls?24AYes.25Does that include analyzing contact information thatSusan Pearce-Bates, RPR, CCR, RSAPrincipal Court Reporter

G. Longstreet-Direct/Mangold31651is relevant to this case?2AYes.3And does that include matching contact information to4text and call records for this case?5AYes.6Are the records provided to the District Attorney's7Office for this case in multiple different formats?8AYes.910Are you, Mr. Bhaumik and Mr. Jarmel-Schneider requiredto analyze and work with the data in all of those differentformats?And is the data provided in different timezones?1112AYes.1314AYes.15And are you,as part of your job, required to convert16 timezones in order to analyze the data?17AYes.1819In total, approximately, how many pages of textmessages have you, Mr. Bhaumik and Mr. Jarmel-Schneider20reviewed in connection with the case?21APages, I would say, maybe like 2500.2223A2425How many have you personally reviewed?Probably around a hundred.Approximately, how many pages of call records haveyou, Mr. Bhaumik and Mr. Jarmel-Schneider reviewed inSusan Pearce-Bates, RPR, CCR, RSAPrincipal Court Reporter

G. Longstreet-Direct/Mangold31661connection with the case?2AOver 10,000 pages.34A5167And how many have you personally reviewed?Probably around two to 3,000.Approximately, how much contact information have youand the other paralegals reviewed in connection with the case?AProbably around 300 to 500 pages.And how many have you personally reviewed?89AOne hundred to 200.101112Approximately, how many contacts have you and theother paralegals have had to match with text and phone records?AAbout 50.1314Did you and Mr. Bhaumik and Mr. Jarmel-Schneider alsoreview and save public court filings that could be relevant tothe case?AYes.1516171819A2021Approximately, how many legal proceedings did you andthe other paralegals review and save items from?Approximately, 75 different cases.Approximately, how many individual court filings,total, did you and the paralegal team review and save?22A232425About 500.Through your work on the case, are you familiar withI am sorry dates of important court filings?an important--AYes.Susan Pearce-Bates, RPR, CCR, RSAPrincipal Court Reporter

G. Longstreet-Direct/Mangold3167Before testifying today, did you have an opportunity12to review files marked for identification as People's Exhibits3407-F, 407-G, 407-H and 407-I?4AYes.15016Are they public posts from the Twitter handle@realDonaldTrump.Who retrieved and saved those posts?7AYes.89AI did.1011A1213Did you save them in a particular way?I did.And did you save them in the same way that you savedthe previous Twitter posts that we discussed last time?14AYes.1516AYes.17Can you briefly remind the jury what that was?So, I just used the platform or the tool that wehave to screenshot, and I then screenshot the post, save it to18a folder that was relevant to the post and then hashed the19post.20And hashing, again, is a way to uniquely identify each21post?22AYeah.2324Are these exhibits exact copies of the public posts.that you saved and hashed?25AYes.Susan Pearce-Bates, RPR, CCR, RSAPrincipal Court Reporter

G. Longstreet-Direct/Mangold12345७7893168The People now offer into evidenceMS. MANGOLD:Exhibits 407-F, G, H and I.MR. BLANCHE:Your Honor, the same objection asdiscussed last week.overruled.THE COURT: Your objection is noted andPeople's Exhibits 407-F, G, H and I areaccepted into evidence.(Whereupon, People's Exhibits 407-F, G, Hand I were received into evidence.)MS. MANGOLD: All right.Can you please display what's now in evidence asPeople's Exhibit 407-F?101112131415AYes.16BY MS. MANGOLD:Ms. Longstreet, is this a Twitter post?1718And I think last time you explained some aspects ofthe social media platform Twitter and how it operated in 2016?AYep.In addition to those questions, can you explain what athread is?192021AYes.2223So, Twitter has a character limit which onlyallows you to put a certain amount of characters for one tweet.So,a way that some users are able to get around the character24 limit is by posting multiple tweets in the same thread so they25are kind of connected to each other in a sense.Susan Pearce-Bates, RPR, CCR, RSAPrincipal Court Reporter

G. Longstreet-Direct/Mangold31691And is this an example of a thread?2AYes.3Is the first post--I am sorryis the top post4shown here the first one in time?5AYep.७7A89AWere all of these posts made the same day?Yes.What Twitter handle was used to make these posts?@realDonaldTrump.10What's the date and time shown for the top post?11AApril 21st, 2018 at 9:10 am.1213Can you please focus on just the top post?Can you read the top post to the jury?14AYes.1516171819the hope that he will flip.20MS. MANGOLD:The New York Times and a third-rate reporter namedMaggie Haberman, known as a Crooked H flunkie, who I don'tspeak to and have nothing to do with, are going out of theirway to destroy Michael Cohen and his relationship with me inThey use dot, dot, dot.Can you pull up the bottom two--212223A2425posts, please?Can you read those?Non-existent sources and a drunk slash drugged uploser who hates Michael, a fine person with a wonderful family,Michael is a businessman for his own account slash lawyer who ISusan Pearce-Bates, RPR, CCR, RSAPrincipal Court Reporter

G. Longstreet-Direct/Mangold1always liked and respected.23453170Most people will flip if theGovernment lets them out of trouble, even if it means lying ormaking up stories. Sorry, I don't see Michael doing thatdespite the horrible Witch Hunt and the dishonest media.What's the date for all three of the posts?७78AApril 21, 2018.MS. MANGOLD: You can take that down.Did the court filings that you reviewed include aFederal criminal case for Michael Cohen?910AYes.1112Was one of the court filings the paralegal team savedfor that case a guilty plea?13AYes.14Do you know the date of that guilty plea?15AI believe it was August 21, 2018.16MS. MANGOLD: Now, can we please display what is1718in evidence as People's Exhibit 407-H?Can you see that, Ms. Longstreet?19AYes.20Is this another Twitter post?21AYes.2223A24What Twitter handle was used to make this post?@realDonaldTrump.And what is the date and time for this post?25AIt ends August 22, 2018 at 8:44 a.m.?Susan Pearce-Bates, RPR, CCR, RSAPrincipal Court Reporter

G. Longstreet-Direct/Mangold1Can you please read this to the jury?2AIf anyone is looking for a good lawyer, I would31713 strongly suggest that you don't retain the services of Michael4Cohen.5७A789And is there an explanation point end of that post?Yes. Sorry.MS. MANGOLD: And can we take this down anddisplay what's in evidence as People's Exhibit 407-1.Is this another Twitter post that you pulled and10saved?11A1213A14Yes.What is the Twitter handle used to make this post?@realDonaldTrump.What is the date and time shown for this post?15AAugust 22, 2018, at 9:21 a.m.1617A1819posted?And is that the same day as the last post we just saw?Yes.How long after the post we just saw was this one20A21I would have to see the timestamp.It's fine. But it was posted the same day?22AYes.23Can you read this post to the jury?24AYes.25I feel very badly for Paul Manafort and his wonderfulSusan Pearce-Bates, RPR, CCR, RSAPrincipal Court Reporter

G. Longstreet-Direct/Mangold31721family.Justice took a 12-year-old tax case, among other23things, applied tremendous pressure on him and unlike MichaelCohen he refused to break, make up stories in order to get a4deal.Such respect for a great man. Explanation point.5MS. MANGOLD:All right.७7We can take that down.Now, finally, can we display what's in evidenceas People's Exhibit 407-G, please?quickly?Can you flip through the pages of this ExhibitMs. Longstreet, is this another Twitter post that youIs this another example of a thread?And how many parts does this thread have?89101112saved?13AYes.1415AYes.1617AThree.1819A2021A2223A2425What was the Twitter handle used to make these posts?@realDonaldTrump.And what is the date and time shown for the top post?May 3rd, 2018 at 6:46 a.m.And can you please read the post for the jury?Mr. Cohen, an attorney, received a monthly retainer,not from the campaign and having nothing to do with thecampaign, from which he entered into through reimbursem*nt aSusan Pearce-Bates, RPR, CCR, RSAPrincipal Court Reporter

G. Longstreet-Direct/Mangold31731private contract between two parties, known as a Non-Disclosure2Agreement or NDA. These agreements are--dot, dot, dot.3450thread.MS. MANGOLD: Then move to the second post to theA Very common amongst celebrities and people of wealth.6 In this case it is in full force and effect and will be used inarbitration for damages against Ms. Clifford, Daniels.The78agreement was used to stop the false and extortionist9accusations made by her about an affair--10And is this now the final post in the thread?11AYes.1213141516Despite already having signed a detailed letteradmitting that there was no affair, prior to its violation byMs. Clifford and her attorney, this was a private agreement.Money for the campaign or campaign contributions played no rolein this transaction.17MS. MANGOLD:Thank you.18192021Can we take that down, please?Now, can we show everyone what's already inevidence as People's Exhibit, 171 A?Ms. Longstreet, do you recognize this?22AYes.23And how do you recognize it?24AThis was something that the paralegal team had to25analyze in response to subpoena compliance.Susan Pearce-Bates, RPR, CCR, RSAPrincipal Court Reporter

G. Longstreet-Direct/Mangold3174So this was produced――this is a document that was12produced to the DA's Office pursuant to a subpoena?3AYes.4And you and the paralegal team analyzed the document5after it was received?16AYes.78Do youMS. MANGOLD: Can you please blow up the twomiddle columns?910QAnd do you see contact information in those middle11columns?12A131415Yes.Based on your work on the case, can you identify theindividuals associated with the contact information providedthere?16A171819Yes.So, looking first on the left, there is somethingredacted, and then it says, @dylanhoward.com.Is that an email address?20AYes.21Do you know who that email address is associated with?22AYes.23Who is it?24ADylan Howard.25And do you see just below that there is an emailSusan Pearce-Bates, RPR, CCR, RSAPrincipal Court Reporter

G. Longstreet-Direct/Mangold31751address that ends, @wideeyecommunications.com?2AYes.34Based upon on your work on the case, can you identifythe individual associated with that email address?5AYes.७Who is it?7ADylan Howard.89Looking now to the other column, do you see where itjust has the letter G?10AYes.1112And there are the last four digits of the phone numbershown there?13AYeah.1415Based on your work on the case, can you identify theindividual associated with that phone number?16AYeah.17Who is it?18AGina Rodriguez.192021(Whereupon, Principal Court Reporter, SusanPearce-Bates was relieved by Senior CourtReporter Theresa Magniccari.)22232425Susan Pearce-Bates, RPR, CCR, RSAPrincipal Court Reporter

LG. Longstreet-Joseph-Direct/Mangold3176(Whereupon, the proceedings were continued from2the following page:)3OT1067861011CONTINUED DIRECT EXAMINATIONBY MS. MANGOLD:Q. Now, if we take a look at the second page of the PDF.The same two columns.MS. MANGOLD:portions near the top.(Displayed.)Q. So, which columnis the "from" column?Can we show both the blue and greenhere is the "to" column, and whichA. The "to" column is on the left and the "from" column ison the right.Q. Is that typical or is it more standard to have those121314151617A.It's more standard to have them switched.18MS. MANGOLD: Now, can we look at the texta19columns switched?20few of the text messages on the right, please.Q. Ms. Longstreet, based on your analysis of the variouscalls and text messages, can you tell what time zone this is2122in?23A.Yes.24Q.What time zone is that?25A.UTC.Theresa MagniccariSenior Court Reporter

L2-G. Longstreet-Joseph Direct/MangoldQ.What is UTC time?A.UTC time is a standardized time zone for everybody.So I don't remember exactly what UTC stands for. It's three34hours ahead based5depending on when Daylight Savings is.Q. Does it correspond with time zones in London?317710A.Yes.786Q. So the New York time zone for these might depend onwhether it was Daylight Savings Time or not?A.Yes.10Q.MS. MANGOLD: If we can zoom back out.Do you see there are portions of this exhibit that havebeen redacted?111213A.Yes.14Q.Who redacted this?15A.I did.16Q.All right.1718192021A.22Q.23A.24Now, turning back to the first page of the document.Focusing on the first five text messages on the right andshowing the "to" and "from" column.Were all of these text messages sent on the same date?Yes.What date is that?April 7, 2016.Q. Can you please read these text messages to the jury25 identifying who they're from and who they're to?Theresa MagniccariSenior Court Reporter

G. Longstreet-Joseph-Direct/Mangold3178LA.2 and it says:So this first one is from Mrs. Rodriguez to Mr. Howard,Stormy Daniels was his mistress.3Then from Mr. Howard to Ms. Rodriguez:I bet she was.From Mr. Howard to Ms. Rodriguez:Can you email me45 what you have on that.10From Ms. Rodriguez to Mr. Howard:Yes. I will send7 you what I have.8From Mr. Howard to Ms. Rodriguez:Great.61011MS. MANGOLD: Can we now turn to Page 2 of thePDF, and focus on the last five text messages shown in thedocument.1213Q.(Displayed.)Were these all sent on the same date?14A.Yes.15Q.16A.17Q.18What date was that?June 28, 2016.Can you please read these to the jury, include whothey're from and who they're to?19A.Yes.2021So this first one is from Ms. Rodriguez to Mr. Howard:Stormy Daniels.22From Ms. Rodriguez to Mr. Howard: I have her.23From Mr. Howard to Ms. Rodriguez: Is she ready to24talk?25From Mr. Howard to Ms. Rodriguez:I thought sheTheresa MagniccariSenior Court Reporter

G. Longstreet-Joseph-Direct/Mangold31791denounced it previously.23From Ms. Rodriguez to Mr. Howard: She said she will doit under two conditions.4слMS. MANGOLD:And can we turn now to the next pageof the PDF.1078ထQ.(Displayed.)I know the font is pretty small, but are you able tosee the date of all of the text messages on this page?6A.Yes.10Q.Are they all the same date?11A.Yes.12Q.And what is that date?13A.June 28, 2016.14Q.15A.16Q.The same date as the page before?Yes.And can you please read the top text message on the17page?18A.Yes.19202122From Ms. Rodriguez to Mr. Howard: She never did.MS. MANGOLD: And can you pull up we'll skipthe next text, and pull up the following four.(Displayed.)23Q.Can you please read these to the jury?24A.Yes.25From Ms. Rodriguez to Mr. Howard: She doesn't want toTheresa MagniccariSenior Court Reporter

G. Longstreet-Joseph-Direct/Mangold31801go on record about it, but will tell the story through a source.2She will take ashe's had sex with him. She wants 100K.3From Mr. Howard to Ms. Rodriguez:Once or ongoingの1011124relationship?5From Ms. Rodriguez to Mr. Howard:A couple of times.6And he promised her a condo, a spot on The Apprentice.78to the Miss America Pageant. He got her in.From Ms. Rodriguez to Mr. Howard: He never didanything for her.MS. MANGOLD: Can you pull up the bottom two textmessages on the page.(Displayed.)She went13Q.Can you read those to the jury?14A.Yes.15From Ms. Rodriguez to Mr. Howard:She met him at a16celebrity golf tournament.She was there with Wicked Pictures.17From Mr. Howard to Ms. Rodriguez:Okay. Let me get18back to you.19Q. Turning now to the next page of the document.Can you20see text messages starting on the date, June 29, 2016?21A.Yes.2223MS. MANGOLD: And can we please pull up the firstthree text messages from that date.24(Displayed.)25Q.And can you read those to the jury once they're up.Theresa MagniccariSenior Court Reporter

G. Longstreet-Joseph-Direct/Mangold31811A.Yes.23From Ms. Rodriguez to Mr. Howard:From Ms. Rodriguez to Mr. Howard:Any word on Stormy?Question mark.Have got to discuss4From Mr. Howard to Ms. Rodriguez:5 it with the Chief.167MS. MANGOLD: Now, can we blow up the last twotext messages on that page.8(Displayed.)9Q.What is the date of these text messages?10A.July 23, 2016.11Q.And can we please read those to the jury?12A.1314Yes.From Ms. Rodriguez to Mr. Howard: What happened withthe Stormy Daniels interview on Trump?15From Mr. Howard to Ms. Rodriguez:Let's discuss it16this week.1718Q. Now, turning to the next page of the PDF. Turning tothe top six text messages on that page.19Are these all from the same date?20A.Yes.21Q.Same date as the page before?22A.Yes.23Q.That's July 23, 2016?24A.Yes.25Q.And can you read these to the jury?Theresa MagniccariSenior Court Reporter

L2G. Longstreet-Joseph-Direct/Mangold3182From Ms. Rodriguez to Mr. Howard: Okay. She isA.Yes.3asking.4From Mr. Howard to Ms. Rodriguez:Let's talk51078face-to-face.From Ms. Rodriguez to Mr. Howard:From Ms. Rodriguez to Mr. Howard:From Mr. Howard to Ms. Rodriguez:night through Wednesday, maybe Thursday.From Ms. Rodriguez to Mr. Howard:Okay.What day this week?I am there SundayLet's meet Thursday.MS. MANGOLD: Can we skip a couple of textmessages, then show the next two.の10111213(Displayed.)14Q.Can you please--I am sorry, what is date of these15text messages?16A.July 29, 2016.17Q.Can you please read these to the jury?18A.Yes.192021Keep that between us.22232425From Mr. Howard to Ms. Rodriguez:Cohen here on Monday on something, so stand by. Will knowtomorrow.From Ms. Rodriguez to Mr. Howard: Okay. If you do, Iwant to come Monday too.MS. MANGOLD: Can we turn to the next page of thePDF, please. If can we show just the top portion of theI'm trying to getTheresa MagniccariSenior Court Reporter

G. Longstreet-Joseph-Direct/MangoldL2I am sorry, just the second text message on the page.(Displayed.)MQ.What is date of this text message?4A.July 31, 2016.слQ.Who is it from?10A. Ms. Rodriguez.7Q.And can you read this to the jury?8A.Yes.6103183Whatever happened with the Stormy Daniels interview?MS. MANGOLD: And can we take that down.Q. Ms. Longstreet, do you see any other text messages fromthat date?MS. MANGOLD: Can we please pull up the next threetext messages.(Displayed.)Were these all sent on the same date?111213A.No.14151617Q.18A.Yes.19Q.20A.21Q.22A.Yes.232425What date?August 8, 2016.Can you please read these to the jury.From Ms. Rodriguez to Mr. Howard:From Mr. Howard to Ms. Rodriguez:Call me.It will have to belater on. Wall to wall meetings for a few hours.Theresa MagniccariSenior Court Reporter

L234сл10G. Longstreet-Joseph-Direct/Mangold3184From Ms. Rodriguez to Mr. Howard:Okay.MS. MANGOLD: Now, can we pull up the last fourtext messages on that page.And, actually, before we do that, can we flip tothe next page of the PDF.(Displayed.)Do you see the date for the text messages on this7Q.8page?6A.10Q.11A.12Q.Yes.And what is the date for the top set of text messages?October 8, 2016.And do you see the timestamps?13A.Yes.14Q.15A.16Q.17A.What are the timestamps for the top few text messages?23:39:52 in UTC time.How about the text messages on the bottom of that page?The timestamp?18Q.What is the date?19A.October 9, 2016.20Q.And what does the timestamp show?21A.They are all between 0017 and 0019.22Q.And is that in UTC time?23Yes.2425be in New York?A.Q. So what would the dates for all of these text messagesTheresa MagniccariSenior Court Reporter

L234сл-G. Longstreet-Joseph Direct/Mangold3185A.October 8, 2016.MS. MANGOLD:Can we now go back to the previouspage and blow up the bottom four text messages.(Displayed.)Q. Are these from October 8, 2016?Can you read these to the jury?10A.Yes.7Q.8A.Yes.6From Ms. Rodriguez to Mr. Howard:Stormy Daniels andTrump with her is up on The Dirty, and Fox News has been1011calling.Stormy has not confirmed or spoken.Are you12interested?13From Mr. Howard to Ms. Rodriguez:She will confirm on14record.Question mark.15161718192021Q.From Ms. Rodriguez to Mr. Howard:From Mr. Howard to Ms. Rodriguez:Can you email me thepitch on Stormy. I need to elevate it to my CEO.MS. MANGOLD: Can you flip to the next page andshow the top three text messages.(Displayed.)And can you read these to the jury?Yes.22A.Yes.2324From Mr. Howard to Ms. Rodriguez:From Ms. Rodriguez to Mr. Howard:He likely will pay.Yes, I will send to25you.Theresa MagniccariSenior Court Reporter

L2G. Longstreet-Joseph-Direct/Mangold3186From Ms. Rodriguez to Mr. Howard:Okay.MS. MANGOLD: And can we please pull up the nextMfive text messages.4сл1078610(Displayed.)Q. And can you please read these to the jury?A. From Mr. Howard to Ms. Rodriguez:Q.From Ms. Rodriguez to Mr. Howard:From Mr. Howard to Ms. Rodriguez:From Ms. Rodriguez to Mr. Howard:From Ms. Rodriguez to Mr. Howard:How much for Stormy?250K.You have that bid?Yes, working on it.GMA wants her too.Turning now to the next page of the PDF. And lookingat the date and timestamps of the text messages on this page.111213What is the date shown for all of these text messages?14A.October 9, 2016.15Q.And what is the timestamp range for these?16A.0019 to 0021 in UTC time.17Q.And what date would these be in New York?18A.October 8, 2016.19Q.Same as the ones we just looked at?20A.21Q.22Yes.Focusing on after the first text messages, thefollowing three, can you read these to the jury?23A.Yes.2425From Ms. Rodriguez to Mr. Howard: Daily Mail too.From Mr. Howard to Ms. Rodriguez: Well, I would buy itTheresa MagniccariSenior Court Reporter

G. Longstreet-Joseph-Direct/Mangold31871but I ain't got 250K. LOL. GMA can't pay her.234сл1078ထ61011They can licensepics, et cetera. I will tie it up ASAP if we can get realisticprice.From Ms. Rodriguez to Mr. Howard: How much?MS. MANGOLD: Can we please blow up the bottomfour text messages on that page.(Displayed.)Q. Can you please read these to the jury.A.Yes.From Mr. Howard to Ms. Rodriguez: I can get 100.From Ms. Rodriguez to Mr. Howard: LOL.From Ms. Rodriguez to Mr. Howard: Okay. What about1213150K?1415161718Q.19A.202122232425From Mr. Howard to Ms. Rodriguez:MS. MANGOLD:110.Can we please go to the next page.Can we please blow up the top four text messages.(Displayed.)Can you read these to the jury?Yes.From Ms. Rodriguez to Mr. Howard: 125K.From Mr. Howard to Ms. Rodriguez: LOL.From Mr. Howard to Ms. Rodriguez: 120.From Ms. Rodriguez to Mr. Howard: Sold.Q.And leaving this up for a second, do you see the dateand timestamps for these text messages?Theresa MagniccariSenior Court Reporter

-G. Longstreet-Joseph Direct/Mangold31881A.Yes.2Q.What is the date of all of them?3A.October 9, 2016.4Q.5A.67What is the timestamp range for these?00:21:27 to 00:21:50 UTC time.Q. And is it your understanding that these are allOctober 8, 2016 in New York time?8A.Yes.91011MS. MANGOLD: Can we please pull up the next fourtext messages. I am sorry, the next three text messages.(Displayed.)12Q.Can you please readI am sorry.Withdrawn.13What are the dates of the top two text messages here?14A.October 9, 2016.1516Q. And were they sent shortly after the text messages wejust saw?17A.Yes.18Q.Can you please read these to the jury?192021222324A. From Mr. Howard to Ms. Rodriguez:will email contract when back at hotel or first thing in a.m.From Ms. Rodriguez to Mr. Howard: Okay.Q. And what is the third text message there, what is thedate and timestamp of that one?A. October 9, 2016 at 18:54:31 UTC time.I'm at dinner. I25Q.What would the date for this one be in New York?Theresa MagniccariSenior Court Reporter

-G. Longstreet-Joseph Direct/Mangold1A.October 9, 2016.2Q.Can you read this one to the jury?3A.From Ms. Rodriguez to Mr. Howard:Daily Mail is4offering 200.5MS. MANGOLD:Thank you.3189७78910Q.You can take that down.Moving on to the next page of the PDF.Can youplease highlight the top two text messages on the page.(Displayed.)Ms. Longstreet, what are the dates of these text11messages?12A. October 9, 2016.13Q.Can you read these to the jury?14A.Yes.151617181920From Ms. Rodriguez to Mr. Howard: I haven't told themanything except what I put in email yesterday.From Ms. Rodriguez to Mr. Howard: They signed NDA andsent over. I haven't responded.MS. MANGOLD: We can take those down.Can we please blow up the following two text21messages.2223Q.24A.(Displayed.)What is the date of these text messages?October 10, 2016.25Q.Can you read these to the jury?Theresa MagniccariSenior Court Reporter

L234G. Longstreet-Joseph-Direct/Mangold3190A.Yes.From Ms. Rodriguez to Mr. Howard:and Stormy leaves tomorrow to go back home.From Mr. Howard to Ms. Rodriguez:Never heard from youD.M. wants it too.Okay. I'll call himQ.10A.11Q.5 in a few hours.10786MS. MANGOLD: Can we pull up the next six textmessages, please.(Displayed.)What is the date of these?October 17, 2016.And can you read these to the jury?12A.From Ms. Rodriguez to Mr. Howard:We're not doing the13Trump deal.14From Mr. Howard to Ms. Rodriguez:Keith gave me a15heads up. What happened?16From Ms. Rodriguez to Mr. Howard:1718They didn't pay whenthey said they would and they keep trying to buy more time.Daily Mail wants it bad, so we're doing it.19From Mr. Howard to Ms. Rodriguez:Fair call.20From Mr. Howard to Ms. Rodriguez:Their loss.21From Ms. Rodriguez to Mr. Howard:Agreed.22232425PDF.MS. MANGOLD: Turning now to the next page of theCan we blow up the fifth text message down and thefive text messages there.(Displayed.)Theresa MagniccariSenior Court Reporter

G. Longstreet-Joseph-Direct/Mangold31911Q.What is date of these text messages?2A.October 19, 2016.3Q.Can you read these to the jury?45A. From Ms. Rodriguez to Mr. Howard:night and we're all good.From Mr. Howard to Ms. Rodriguez:Spoke to Keith lastOkay.Sorted out.Redacted.78From Mr. Howard to Ms. Rodriguez:From Ms. Rodriguez to Mr. Howard:9From Mr. Howard to Ms. Rodriguez:Good.1011MS. MANGOLD: And can we please pull up the nexttwo text messages.12(Displayed.)13Q.What is date of these text messages?14A.October 25, 2016.15MS. MANGOLD:Turning now to the next page of the161718PDF.Q. Are all of the text messages on this page also thatsame date?19A.Yes.202122232425MS. MANGOLD:Going back one page and pulling upthe bottom three text messages.Q. Can you read the top two to the jury?A. From Ms. Rodriguez to Mr. Howard: On phone with Katieand Stormy.From Mr. Howard to Ms. Rodriguez: Okay. I blew aTheresa MagniccariSenior Court Reporter

1234OTG. Longstreet-Joseph Direct/Mangold-3192gasket at his people and told them not to f*ck with people.Message made and heard.MS. MANGOLD: Turning now to the next page. Canyou highlight the bottom five text messages on this page.(Displayed.)Q. Can you read these to the jury?107A.Yes.8From Mr. Howard to Ms. Rodriguez:I had to apologize6to my CEO.10From Mr. Howard to Ms. Rodriguez:I explained that two1112people saved his ass today and meeting his call with his peopleand I am going to tell them how it's going to be.13From Ms. Rodriguez to Mr. Howard:Thank you so much.14You think it will happen?15From Mr. Howard to Ms. Rodriguez:Yes.They were told16in no uncertain terms.17From Mr. Howard to Ms. Rodriguez:I'm not going to18burn my lifelong contact for these f*ckers.19MS. MANGOLD: And turning to the next page of the20PDF. Starting with the text messagethe first text212223message, dated October 26, 2016. Can you pull up thosefirst three.(Displayed.)24Q.Can you read these to the jury?25A.From Ms. Rodriguez to Mr. Howard:They didn't pay andTheresa MagniccariSenior Court Reporter

G. Longstreet-Joseph-Cross/Blanche319312morning.3she doesn't believe it and she's doing her press conf. in theShe hired another attorney.From Mr. Howard to Ms. Rodriguez: What deadline did4they have?5From Ms. Rodriguez to Mr. Howard:This morning.७78910Q.11A.12Q.13A.1415MS. MANGOLD: And can we turn to the next page ofthe PDF, please. And highlight the last text message onthe page.(Displayed.)What is the date of that text message?October 26, 2016.And can you read that to the jury?From Mr. Howard to Ms. Rodriguez: Good news I hear.MS. MANGOLD: I have no further questions.THE COURT: Your witness.16CROSS EXAMINATION17BY MR. BLANCHE:18Q.Good morning again, Ms. Longstreet.1920A.How are you?Good. How are you?21Q.We spoke last Friday; correct?22A.We did.23Q.2425So I am not going to re-ask all the questions that Iasked last Friday about the work that you did.The first was talking about the tweets and the Truth'sTheresa MagniccariSenior Court Reporter

G. Longstreet-Joseph-Cross/Blanche13194that you reviewed. I believe you testified last week, but2 correct me if I am wrong, that you reviewed thousands of tweets3and Truths as part of your work on this case?Q. And the tweets that we saw today, again, you didn't4A.I did.5106select which ones to put up out of the thousands that you78reviewed, for example; the table here and to my right selectedthem; right?16A.That's correct.1011Q. And since you testified last Friday, have you beentasked with doing any additional social media reviews of anybody12involved in this case?13A. Like additional review that wasn't already being done14before?15Q.Yes.16A.No.17Q.So you're still not reviewing Mr. Cohen's TikTok?18A.Not currently, no.19202122Q. You're not aware of something that he TikTok'd twonights ago, for example, on Wednesday night?MS. MANGOLD: Objection.THE COURT: Overruled.23A.I am not.24Q.25Turning to the number of text messages that you justread back and forth, you've been in court every day during thisTheresa MagniccariSenior Court Reporter

-G. Longstreet-Joseph Cross/BlancheAnd you were here when Mr. Pecker testified?1trial; correct?2A.Correct.3Q.4A.Yes.5163195Q. And you're aware that he was shown a number of textmessages that he was a participant in; correct?7A.Yes.810119Q. And when he was shown text messages that he was aparticipant in, you recall questions being asked of him aboutwhat he meant by that or what his understanding was of whatsomebody else sent to him?12A.Yes.1314151617181920Q. And you agree that the text messages that you justread, you have no personal knowledge about the reason they weresent or even whether they were accurate when they were sent byeither of the folks, Ms. Rodriguez or Mr. Howard; do you?A. No personal knowledge, no.When, for example, Ms. Rodriguez talks about offersfrom the Daily Mail and the timing of those offers, you have noknowledge about whether she was telling the truth; do you?21A.No.2223Q. And you have no knowledge about any of theknowledge about the truthfulness or the reasoning behind theno24text that Mr. Howard sent in response, or because of whatever25Ms. Rodriguez said; correct?Theresa MagniccariSenior Court Reporter

G. Longstreet-Joseph-Cross/BlancheLA.Can you ask that again.2Q.Sure.31963You have no personal knowledge about either thecommunications that Mr. Howard initiated or that he responded to5 in the series of text messages that you were106read to the jury; correct?that you just7A.810Correct.Q. It's a long way of saying, you just read what waswritten on the exhibit; correct?10A.Yes.1112Q. And that's different, would you agree, than whenMr. Pecker was asked about the reasoning behind text messagesand what he meant by that; correct?1314A.Yes.15Q.And same with Ms. Hicks?16A.Yes.17MR. BLANCHE:Excuse me, your Honor.181920(Brief pause.)Q. Now, by the way, the same with the text messages ofMr. Cohen, correct, meaning, you didn't read any today, but you21have reviewed as part of your work on this case text messages22sent and received from Mr. Cohen as well; correct?23A.Yes.24Q.25Now, going back briefly to the social media that youreviewed, were you also tasked with reviewing Ms. Daniels'Theresa MagniccariSenior Court Reporter

G. Longstreet-Joseph-Cross/Blanchesocial media over the last couple of years?3197And are you continuing to review it during this trial?12A.Yes.mQ.4A.Yes.5Q. Did you review it, for example, this week or last106night?7A.8Not last night, but I think earlier in the week at somepoint, yeah.1610Q. And as part of that review, not limiting it toMs. Daniels, but to all the parties that your reviewing, when11you observe something that you believe to be interesting,what's12the process that you use to alert that to your team?1314A. Well, I think it depends. I think there are somethings that I just know for a fact we would want to have saved1516171819202122A.232425to our case file.There are other things I have a question about, I willcall one of the attorneys and ask them if they think I shouldpull it or not.Q. Basically, not to but based upon the information youprovide them, the Prosecutors that you work with decide whetherto use it or not use it%;B correct?Basically, yeah.MR. BLANCHE: No further questions, your Honor.THE COURT: Anything else?MS. MANGOLD: No, your Honor.Theresa MagniccariSenior Court Reporter

L234сл10J.Jarmel-Schneider Direct/Conroy(Witness excused.)THE COURT: Your next witness.MR. CONROY: Judge, the People call JadenJarmel-Schneider.(Witness entering courtroom.)319878610111213THE CLERK: Do you solemnly swear or affirm thatthe testimony that you are going to give before this Courtand jury shall be the truth, the whole truth, and nothingbut the truth, do you so swear or affirm?THE WITNESS: I do.called as a witness14151617J-A-D-E-NJ-A-R-M-E-L--S-C-H-N-E-I-D-E-R,on behalf of the People, was duly sworn by the Clerk, upon beingexamined, testified as follows:THE CLERK: Have a seat.COURT OFFICER: State your full name for the18record, spelling your last name.192021222324THE WITNESS:S-C-N-N-E-I-D-E-R.COURT OFFICER:County of residence?THE WITNESS: New York County.THE COURT: Good afternoon.You may inquire.Jaden Jarmel-Scheider, J-A-R-M-E-L,25MR. CONROY:Thank you.Theresa MagniccariSenior Court Reporter

J.Jarmel-SchneiderDirect/Conroy45A.L23DIRECT EXAMINATIONBY MR. CONROY:Q.Good afternoon, Mr. Schneider.Where do you work?I work at the New York County District Attorney's106Office.7Q.How long have you worked there?8A.Coming up on two years.10Q.And what is your current position there?10A.319911I am a paralegal.Q. What are some of the things that you do as a paralegalat the DA's office?A. It really runs the gamut. But, in general, we help theattorneys: Sending out subpoenas and kind of organizing andanalyzing whatever records we receive in response.12131415161718Trump?19A.Yes.20Q. In your work as a paralegal at the District Attorney'soffice, were you assigned to an investigation involving Donald21Q. As part of your role in that investigation, were youtasked with analyzing phone records pertaining to the case?22A.Yes.23Q.24A.25Q.Was it phone records and also other kinds of records?Yes.Did the phone records include the AT&T records that areTheresa MagniccariSenior Court Reporter

J.Jarmel-SchneiderDirect/Conroy32001contained in what was admitted earlier today in People's Exhibit2400?3A.Yes.4Q.Did it also include the Verizon records that were5 admitted into evidence earlier today as People's Exhibit 401?10A.Yes.786101112131415Q. Can you tell us, generally, what is contained withinthose phone records?A.So we generally get two kinds of records.Subscriber records review basic information about theuser associated with the phone record.Call detail records, which are kind of a log of all theincoming and outgoing calls associated with whatever number wassubpoenaed.Q.What format are the phone records in when you get16 them?A.Depends on the phone carrier.So, for AT&T, we got them as PDF text files, imageFor Verizon, we get them as Excel spreadsheets and Worddocuments and PDF.171819files.202122232425A.Yes.Q. In your work reviewing various phone records, did youalso review information contained in data extractions fromMichael Cohen's phones?Theresa MagniccariSenior Court Reporter

J.Jarmel-Schneider Direct/Conroy3201L2345Q.What did you review?A.I reviewed Cellebrite reports, which is the applicationused to review the data that is extracted on call logs, contactlists, calendar invites, various pieces of metadata, et cetera.Q. Did that include what is in evidencecontact1067information from those phones, that is in evidence currently asPeople's 263 and 264?8A.Yes.610Q. Did it include text messages that are in evidence asPeople's 249 through 251, 255 through 260 and 262?11A.Yes.12Q. Did it include call logs that are in evidence as13People's 261?14A.Yes.1516Q. Did you also review subscriber information contained inPeople's 400 and 401?17A.Yes.1819Q. Did you also review a contact list contained inPeople's 69B in evidence?20A.I did.21Q.In your work on the investigation, did you prepare a22summary report--several summary reports orwithdrawn.2324Let me rephrase that.In your work on the investigation, did you prepare a25summary report of contact information?Theresa MagniccariSenior Court Reporter

J.Jarmel-SchneiderDirect/ConroyLA.I did.2Q.What information did you rely on in making that320234report?A.So I looked at the subscriber records that I mentioned5 from AT&T and Verizon. I also looked at other pieces of1067810documentary records; text messages, records, email signatures,contact lists produced by The Trump Organization. I also lookedat the contact lists that were extracted from Mr. Cohen's cellphones.1011Q.What was the purpose of creating this report?A.We wanted to give the jury a sense of how we figured1314151612out which phone numbers were associated with which people. Kindof where the phone numbers would show up in the evidence that weultimately used.Q. Are the records that you relied on in making this chartall in evidence in this case?1718A.Yes.MR. CONROY: If wecan pull up for the Court and1920parties and the witness, but not the jury, what's beenmarked as People's 416 for identification.21Q.Do you recognize what that is?22A.Yes.23Q.What is it?24A.This is the phone key I was just talking about.25Q.You created this?Theresa MagniccariSenior Court Reporter

J.Jarmel-Schneider Direct/Conroy3203LA.I did.2Q.Are there redactions in this chart?MA.Yes.4Q.What is redacted?слA.10Q.The first six digits of all the phone numbers.Other than that, is this an exact copy of the key that7 you created?8A.Yes.610111213141516MR. CONROY: At this time, I would offer People's416 into evidence.evidence.)MR. BOVE: No objection.THE COURT: 416 is accepted into evidence.(Whereupon, People's Exhibit 416 was accepted intoMR. CONROY: If we can display that to the jury.(Displayed.)17Q.Can you walk us through what we're looking at?18A.Sure.1920So in the right column under the heading "Exhibit," itshows what the source document was and what exhibit number it21came from.2223In the left column called "Phone Number,' it is thephone number."24And the next column is the name as it appears on the25source document, on the exhibit.Theresa MagniccariSenior Court Reporter

J.Jarmel-SchneiderDirect/Conroy3204123Under the "source column," it's just the kind ofrecord; email, text, contact list, et cetera.Q.For some of the rows, there is one name associated with4 a number, but then there are multiple sources; why is that?51067A. A lot of the phone numbers we saw in several differentplaces, so we put various documents that we found them on justto corroborate that the phone number did belong to the person8 that is listed next to them.6101112MR. CONROY: Okay. We can take that down.Q. I now want to talk about another part of the work thatyou did with the phone records here. Did you create a number ofsummaries of phone records?13A.Yes.14Q.What was contained in those summaries?15A.These are just logs of phone calls between pairs of1617181920212223people.Q. You mentioned that you received the records that wejust discussed earlier in a number of file formats, particularlythe records now in People's 400 and 401 from AT&T and Verizon.Starting with the AT&T records, how did you go aboutputting data in the summary?A. We have a software that reads through the text files,the AT&T files. It allows us to file and sort by phone number,24date, caller, et cetera.25We uploaded the text files, filtered and sorted andTheresa MagniccariSenior Court Reporter

LJ.Jarmel-Schneider Direct/Conroyformatted them to look pretty.32052Q.What did you do with the Verizon records?3A.51067So the Verizon records were a particular year. Theycame in as a PDF. We made them text readable, uploaded the textinto Excel, wrote simple scripts to extract the information thatwas put into a format that was file readable. Then we justfiltered again by date and time, caller phone number, et cetera.8 Then formatted them.の10Q. In addition to what's in evidence as People's 400 and401, did you include any other records in the call summaries?11A.Yes.12Q.Do you recall what date?13A.In somecases we put calls that were taken off of the141516Q.call log that is in evidence as 261, which is calls pulled fromMr. Cohen's phone.What was the purpose of creating these summaries?17A.So,as you might have seen, the phone records are1819somewhat hard to decipher.associated with the phone number.They don't list which caller isThey're all different time20zones.2122232425And kind of, more importantly, they include a lot ofextraneous outside calls of people that are not relevant. Wewanted to create summaries that were a bit more digestible andeasy and by time zone.Q. You mentioned different time zones; how did youTheresa MagniccariSenior Court Reporter

J.Jarmel-SchneiderDirect/Conroy1standardize the records for the time zones?2A.So it differed between AT&T and Verizon.32063For AT&T, all the time zones were in UTC. We were able4 to mass convert them to Eastern Standard Time. We accounted for510Daylight Savings Time.For Verizon, the time zone depended on the location7 they were in when they made or received the call. We went8 through and determined the location, which was listed on thecall detail records, and converted them to all New York time,we standardized everything to New York time.の10 which is to say,1112Q. Now, are the summaries of the phone records basedsolely on the information contained in exhibits already in13 evidence?14A.Yes.15Q.And are those the exhibits we already discussed?16A.Yes.17181920Q. In preparing the summaries of the phone records, didyou ensure that the information you were including in thesummaries fairly and accurately reflected the information in theexhibits in evidence?21A.Yes.22Q.How did you do that?23A.So after we made the summaries, we went through24 line-by-line and compared to the underlying call detail record.25Q. Have you reviewed what's been marked previously asTheresa MagniccariSenior Court Reporter

LJ.Jarmel-SchneiderDirect/Conroy3207People's 337 through 342 and 344 through 349 for identification?2A.Yes.MQ. And is People's 337 calls between Michael Cohen and4 Keith Davidson?510A.Yes.Q. Is People's 338 calls between Michael Cohen and HopeHicks?78A.Yes.6Q. Is People's 339 calls between Michael Cohen and DylanHoward?Is People's 340 calls between Michael Cohen and David1011A.Yes.12Q.13Pecker?14A.Yes.15Q.16 Schiller?Is People's 341 calls between Michael Cohen and KeithQ. Is People's 342 calls between Michael Cohen and AllenWeisselberg?Q. Is People's 344 calls between Keith Davidson and GinaRodriguez?17A.Yes.181920A.Yes.212223A.Yes.24Q. Is People's 345 calls between Dylan Howard and Keith25 Davidson?Theresa MagniccariSenior Court Reporter

J.Jarmel-Schneider Direct/ConroyYes.Is People's 346 calls between Dylan Howard and DavidLA.2Q.3Pecker?4A.Yes.5106Q. Is People's 347 calls between Dylan Howard and GinaRodriguez?7A.Yes.8610Q. Is People's 348 calls between The Trump Organizationand Michael Cohen?A.Yes.3208Is People's 349 calls between the Defendant and MichaelAnd are those the phone summaries that you created?MR. CONROY: At this time, I offer People's 337through 342 and 344 through 349 into evidence.MR. BOVE: No objection.11Q.12Cohen?13A.Yes.14Q.15A.Yes.16171819202122232425THE COURT: 337 through 342 and 344 through 349are received into evidence.MR. CONROY: Thank you.(Whereupon, People's Exhibits 337 through 342and 344 through 349 were received and marked intoevidence.)MR. CONROY: If we can pull up what's in evidenceTheresa MagniccariSenior Court Reporter

J.Jarmel-SchneiderDirect/Conroy3209L23510as People's 342 for everybody.(Displayed.)Q. And if you could, again, sort of explain to us aboutwhat the different columns are and what we're seeing.Is this a representative example of one of thesummaries that you created?67A.Somewhat short one, but, yes.8のQ. But, basically, they all look the same; some may belonger?10A.Yes.1112Q. Is this call between Michael Cohen and AllenWeisselberg?13A.Yes.14Q.Do we see that on the top left of the chart?15A.Yes.16Q.We saw some redactions. What is redacted in these17charts?18A.The first six digits of every phone number.19Q.What are the numbers next to Michael Cohen and the name202122232.Allen Weisselberg?A. Michael Cohen has 0114 and Allen Weisselberg has 7224and 4509.Can you walk us through what this chart demonstrates?24A.So the left column is the date and time in Eastern25Time.Theresa MagniccariSenior Court Reporter

J.Jarmel-SchneiderDirect/Conroy32101The second column is the date and time in UTC, which is2 how it was originally recorded in the AT&T records.35106786101112The "time" column tells whether the call is a text orvoicemail.number.The "from" tells you who the call is from, the phoneAnd the "to" column tells you who the call is to.The "duration: Is how long the call was, the minutes.The 'source: Column tells you which phone carrier orwhere we got the records from.Q.Thank you.And, again, I am not going to walk through all of theDo they all have the same format?13 exhibits we admitted.14A.Yes.15MR. CONROY: Thank you.16171819You can take that down.Could we now pull up what is in evidence asPeople's 247.(Displayed.)20Q.Do you recognize what this is?21A.I do.22Q.What is it?23A. This is a Cellebrite report showing the metadata24 associated with the recording that was extracted from Michael25Cohen's phone.Theresa MagniccariSenior Court Reporter

J.Jarmel-SchneiderDirect/Conroy32111Q. Can you see on this report the approximate time that2 the recording ended?35106786A. Not exactly, but you can figure it out. The timestampof the recording is 10:56 and 42 seconds a.m. in New York time.And the duration of the recording is 2 minutes and 51 seconds.If you add them together, the recording ended at 10:59 and about30 seconds a.m. in New York City time.MR. CONROY: Okay. We can take that down.Q. Did you also review the call records already inevidence as People's 400 and 401?1011A.I did.12Q.Did you review records relating to the phone ending in130114?14A.Yes.15Q.Who did that phone number belong to?16A.Michael Cohen.1718Q. Did you identify incoming calls to that phone numberthat began at approximately the same time as the recording19ended?20A.Yes.212223MR. CONROY:Could we pull up from People's 400the page, Bates Number DANY ID DJ00002726, which isredacted, to be displayed.24(Displayed.)25Q.Do you see the call that we just talked about on here?Theresa MagniccariSenior Court Reporter

J.Jarmel-Schneider Direct/Conroy32121A.Yes.2Q.What line number is that call on this report?3A.It's line 6126192.4Q.And what was the connection time on that call?5A.This is 2:59 and 53 seconds in UTC time. At that time6of year, that would have been at 10:59 and 53 seconds New York7City time.8Q.9How long was the seizure time on this call?Twenty-three seconds.10Q.131415161718191112A.And what is the time of this call in relation to whenthe recording ended that we just looked at on People's 247?a.m.A. So the recording ended at 10:59 and about 30 secondsEastern Time. So this call was connected about 20, 22, 23seconds later.MR. CONROY: Thank you.We can pull that down.Now, can we pull up just for the parties and thewitness and the Judge what has been marked as People's 350for identification.20Q.Do you recognize this?21A.22Q.23A.24I do.What is this?This is a summary chart of what's in evidence asPeople's Exhibits 1 through 34.25Q. Did you review and confirm People 350 forTheresa MagniccariSenior Court Reporter

J.Jarmel-Schneider Direct/Conroy321312identification?A.I did.3Q.Can you describe how you did that?4A.So I looked at the chart and I went back to each5exhibit that it references and cross-referenced to make sure6everything was accurately reflected.7Q. What kinds of documents are People's 1 through 34?8A. They are invoices, vouchers from The Trump9Organization's Multi Data System and checks.10Q. And does the information in the chart that we11designated People's Exhibit 350 for identification exactly12reflect information taken from People's Exhibit 1 through 34 in13evidence?14A.Yes.1516171819202122232425MR. BOVE: I do have an objection. If we can goto sidebar.(Whereupon, proceedings were held at sidebar:)MR. BOVE: Judge, our objection is justobjection is to the text on the bottom right, "false"business records, or something like to that effect.Some things popped up on the screen.Has it been modified?MR. CONROY: No.MR. BOVE:anticipating my objection.ourThey're doing it advance. They'reTheresa MagniccariSenior Court Reporter

L234сл10786J.Jarmel-SchneiderDirect/Conroy3214MR. CONROY: You said your objectionMR. BOVE: Judge, this is unduly argumentative.MR. CONROY: This is a summary of the 34 businessrecords, and essentially it's to assist the jury inassociating the specific business records with counts.We have no problem with some kind of instructionto the jury that the title is not in evidence, but theseare records that we're alleging are business records.THE COURT: What is the purpose for introducing itinto evidence now?You can probably do it on summation. You can doit in summation. I think it would be perfectly appropriateat that time.MR. CONROY: So could weI am just trying tothink how we can modify it.Can we call it "alleged false business records?"MR. BOVE: There is a title. It says, "TheI think if you can keep the text on the top,Just get the summaryjust redact the title on the bottom.101112131415161718Counts."1920in.212223Okay?2425THE COURT: You have it.I think for summation you won't have an argument.MR. CONROY: Okay.(Whereupon, the following proceedings were held inTheresa MagniccariSenior Court Reporter

L234От1078の10J.Jarmel-SchneiderDirect/Conroy3215open court:)THE COURT: Mr. Bove, we resolved your objectionas discussed at the bench.MR. BOVE: Thank you, Judge.MR. CONROY: If we canwhen you are ready,display just for the parties, the Court and the witness thesummary chart again.Judge, at this time the People offer People's 350for identification into evidence.MR. BOVE: As modified, no objection.THE COURT:Subject to redaction.(Whereupon, People's Exhibit 350 was received into111213evidence.)14MR. CONROY: If wecan display that for everybody.15(Displayed.)16CONTINUED DIRECT EXAMINATION17BY MR. CONROY:18Q.Can you just walk us through, again--first of all,1920A.what is this summarizing?This is summarizing People's Exhibits 1 through 34 in21evidence.22Q.And are there three different rows?23A.Yes.24Q.Can you tell us what each row indicates?25A.The top row are invoices.The middle row are vouchers.Theresa MagniccariSenior Court Reporter

J.Jarmel-SchneiderDirect/Conroy1And the bottom row are the checks.2Q.And, then, are there columns by month?3A.Yes.4Q.3216Starting with the invoices, is there only one invoice5 for the months of January and February?And below that, for January and February, are there two10A.Yes.7Q.8 vouchers?6A.Yes.1011Q. What information is included in this chart for thevouchers?12A.13The dollar amount of the voucher entry in some of themonths, and all of the months the number associated with the14voucher entry.1516171819202122the indictment.Q. Just going back up to the invoice, what information isincluded in the invoice row?A.The date of the invoice and the dollar amount requestedon the invoice.Q.And then below those two things, there is somethingcalled "count number," what is that?A. Each of these exhibits is associated with a count inSo, the red "count number" corresponds to that23count.2425(Whereupon, Theresa Magniccari, Senior Court Reporterwas relieved by Laurie Eisenberg, Senior Court Reporter.)Theresa Magniccari

12J. Jarmel-Schneider-Direct/Conroy3217And if we could just continue going down January andFebruary, those two columns, we talked about the one invoice,two vouchers; and is there only one check?34AYes.5with?How many invoices were there, in total, on this chart?Eleven.And can you just read which counts they're associatedCounts 1, 5, 8, 11, 14, 17, 20, 23, 26, 29 and 32.After January and February, is there one invoice foreach month for the rest of the year?Going down to vouchers, same question. Could you justread the count number for each of the vouchers?७A789A101112AYes.131415ASure.161718A192021ASure.22232425AYes.Counts 2, 3, 6, 9, 12, 15, 18, 21, 24, 27, 30 and 33.And is there one voucher for every month in 2017?Yes.And, finally, in checks, could you read the countnumber for each check?It's counts 4, 7, 10, 13, 16, 19, 22, 25, 28, 31 and 34.And after January and February, is there one check foreach of the remaining months in 2017?Laurie Eisenberg, CSR, RPRSenior Court Reporter

J. Jarmel-Schneider-Direct/Cross32181And if we look at the column--23the column all the wayon the right where there are just three blue boxes, can youtell us what those are?4AIt's just tallying up the number of each category of5record.6And then, at the bottom where it says "business7records"?8AThis is the total number of business records.910Is that also the total number of counts in theindictment?11AYes.12131415161718192021A2223A2425QMR. CONROY: I have nothing further.THE COURT: Mr. Bove, please.MR. BOVE: Thank you, Judge.May I inquire?THE COURT: Yes.MR. BOVE: Thank you.CROSS-EXAMINATIONBY MR. BOVE:Mr. Schneider or Mr. Jarmel-Schneider?Whichever is easier for you.What's your preference?Jarmel-Schneider.Thank you.Mr. Jarmel-Schneider, you testified about some callLaurie Eisenberg, CSR, RPRSenior Court Reporter

J. Jarmel-Schneider Cross/Bove32191summary charts; right?2AYes.34A5That sounded like a lot of work.Yes.At times, arguably, tedious work?Could be.The tolling.Honestly, I kind of enjoyed it.I hear that.16A78A910Respect.1112Q13right?14A15(Laughter from the audience.)A lot of that work had to take place before the trial;All of it.Because you've been sitting over here (indicating) the16 whole trial; correct?17AYes.1819So, you know that there were summaries that were sortof finalized from a quality control perspective, from yourstandpoint, and then produced to President Trump before thetrial; right?A What do you mean?202122232425before the trial; right?Versions of those charts that were marked as exhibits,produced and marked as exhibits, were produced to the defenseLaurie Eisenberg, CSR, RPRSenior Court Reporter

J. Jarmel-Schneider Cross/Bove1AYes.2Q Those are the ones that passed muster, from your3perspective?4AI would like to think they all did.32205७8910Right.The ones that were produced before the trial?7AYes.Just so we're clear, the ones that are in evidence noware not actually summaries of every toll between theparticipants on the chart; right?11ΑNo. That would be tens of hundreds of thousands of12calls.13Just as14an example, going to Exhibit 337 is a callsummary chart, calls between Michael Cohen and Keith Davidson.15AYes.1617And the one that's admitted in evidence is not asummary of every toll that you have between those twoindividuals; right?1819ARight.202122We narrowed down by a time period.So, there were some deletions from the charts madethis week; right?23AUh, I guess so.24When you say "narrowed down", some things were cut?25AYes.Laurie Eisenberg, CSR, RPRSenior Court Reporter

J. Jarmel-SchneiderCross/Bove3221123415016And so, for Mr. Cohen and Mr. Davidson, there's abouta page-and-a-half of calls cut from 2018; right?A I don't know from the top of my head.Let me think about the best way to do this.I want to show you what's been marked for identification asDefense P-1.MR. BOVE: Mr. Bernik, this is just for theparties, the Court and the witness.(Whereupon, the exhibit is shown on the screensof the witness and the parties.)MR. BOVE: If we could flip to the page that hasGovernment Exhibit 337.(Whereupon, an exhibit is shown on the screens ofthe witness and the parties.)789101112131415QYou see that?16AYes.1718192021222324A25MR. BOVE: If you can hold on one second. I thinkwe're having technical difficulty.(Whereupon, the Defense confers.)(Whereupon, an exhibit is shown on the screens ofthe witness and the parties.)This is the Government's Exhibit List, right; yourecognize that?This is some version of it, yes.MR. BOVE: Can we take a look at the first page,Laurie Eisenberg, CSR, RPRSenior Court Reporter

J. Jarmel-Schneider Cross/Bove3222(Whereupon, an exhibit is shown on the screens ofthe witness and the parties.)1please.2345AYes.You see it's dated April 16, 2024?167A8910111213A1415That's right after the trial started; right?Yes.MR. BOVE: If we can go back to the part thatreflects Exhibits 336 and 337.(Whereupon, an exhibit is shown on the screens ofthe witness and the parties.)There's Bates ranges in the far-right column; right?Yes.Those are, basically, the page numbers that were onthis exhibit when it was given to the Defense; right?16AYes.17Do you have a hard copy of 336 up there?18AI do not.19202122232425QMR.hard copy of 337?(Whereupon, the People give documents toMr. Bove, who then gives the document to the court officerto give to the witness, and the witness reviews thedocument.People's Exhibit 337 has Bates numbers, and I'll useBOVE: Can I trouble the Government for aLaurie Eisenberg, CSR, RPRSenior Court Reporter

J. Jarmel-Schneider Cross/Bove1it to comparejust a few pages; right?2AThat's right.3Because some pages were deleted; right?4AYes.5And they're from 2018; correct?QAnd you were here during the cross-examination of16AYes.789AI was.Keith Davidson; right?322310And you were here when the Defense admitted recordingsof conversations between Keith Davidson and Michael Cohen;right?I was.And then, a subsequent decision was made to deletetoll records from the summary chart in 2018?ANo. I don't think that's correct.You don't think that time sequence is correct?111213A1415161718A1920212223AYes.24I think the time sequence is correctI'm not going to ask you about the purpose.I'm just asking about the time sequence.You were here early this morning when there were some textmessages read between Dylan Howard and Gina Rodriguez; right?25You admitted a call summary marked GovernmentExhibit 344 of marked call records of Keith Davidson and GinaLaurie Eisenberg, CSR, RPRSenior Court Reporter

J. Jarmel-Schneider Cross/Bove32241Rodriguez; right?2AYes.That's another exhibit where, this week, a significant34 number of calls were removed; right?A I don't know about "significant", but they wereI don't know off the top of my head.MR. BOVE: Mr. Conroy, do you have a copy of 344?MR. CONROY: I need the Bates number.Who is it between?56shortened.7QThree pages worth?8A910111213141516AYes.171819A20MR. STEINGLASS: Rodriguez and Davidson.MR. BOVE: 4269.Just to try to move along, you remember deletingseveral pages from 344; correct?Now, you also testified about some call summariesrelating to Michael Cohen; correct?Correct.And one of the phone numbers that you looked at withrespect to Michael Cohen ended in 0144; right?That's the attention to detail I was talking about.2122A0114.232425Thank you.So, that's a number that you had to get familiar withLaurie Eisenberg, CSR, RPRSenior Court Reporter

J. Jarmel-SchneiderCross/Bove3225because it cut across a bunch of these charts; right?You testified that you also familiarized yourself with12AYes.345the electronic phone evidence that's been presented here at thetrial; correct?16AYes.78A910And that came in through Mr. Daus; right?Correct.And he testified about the contents of two cellphones; right?11AYes.1213He called them CP1 and CP2.Do you remember that?14AYes.1516Ω CP1 was associated with the phone number 0114 was histestimony; right?17AThat's correct.18And you looked at thosethe data extracted from19those phones to help prepare the summaries; right?20AYes.2122with--with CP1?23A2425Do you recall what that IMEI number was associatedyou can say noIt's like a 20-digit code. I don't know.MR. BOVE: If we could bring up for the witness,the parties, and the Court, Defense Exhibit G-10.Laurie Eisenberg, CSR, RPRSenior Court Reporter

12345J. Jarmel-Schneider Cross/BoveGo to Page 3, please.3226(Whereupon, an exhibit is shown on the screens ofthe witness and the parties.)Do you see it says"'IMEI" labeled at the bottom? It789ends in 997431; correct?AQCorrect.So, that's the IMEI associated with the deviceMr. Daus talked about as CP1; right?AThat's my understanding, yes.He said it had the number ending 0114; correct?Correct.MR. BOVE: If we could take a look at Government319. It's in evidence. Everybody can look at this one.(Whereupon, an exhibit is shown on the screens.)You remember some testimony about this.It's a screenshot of a text message; right?1011A12131415Q1617AYes.18192021AYes.22232425AYes.And there were some questions about whether there werephone calls around the time of that bottom message.Do you see what that message says?"The President wants to know if you called DavidPecker again?"Do you see that?Laurie Eisenberg, CSR, RPRSenior Court Reporter

J. Jarmel-SchneiderCross/Bove322712At this trial, you're sort of the guardian of the tollrecords; right?3AI don't know if I'd say that, but if you say so.4There areno toll records in evidence that reflect56calls between Hope Hicks and David Pecker around this timeperiod; are there?7AI don't think that's true, but I would have to look at89the underlying records.Do you know what they're marked?10AIt would be in either People's 400 or 401.1112131415A16171819202122Hope Hicks wasn't a part of the Verizon records, so itwould be in 401.And there's no call summary chart between the phonecalls between Hope Hicks and David Pecker; is that correct?That's correct.The last thing I want to talk about the GovernmentExhibit 247, which is in evidence.MR. BOVE: If you could bring that up, please.(Whereupon, an exhibit is shown on the screens.)MR. BOVE: Zoom in as best we can.So, this is that recording file off the physicaldevice marked CP1; right?23AYes.2425And you said based on the file nametimestamp, time field, that it is dated September 6, 2016?there's thatLaurie Eisenberg, CSR, RPRSenior Court Reporter

J. Jarmel-Schneider Cross/Bove1AYes. That's the timestamp.322889101112131415A2345167Q And then we looked at Government Exhibit 400 for acall that you said came in around this time?AAround the time that the recording ended.MR. BOVE: And so, if we could bring upGovernment Exhibit 400 with the Bates ending 2726, please.If we could ask the Government to do this so wecould have the right redactions.(Whereupon, an exhibit is shown on the screens.)MR. BOVE: This can be for everybody.We can zoom in on rows 2691 and 92, please.(Whereupon, an exhibit is shown on the screens.)Mr. Conroy asked you some questions about the secondone, 26192; right?Uh-huh. Yes.16Andbut, the one above it, 26191, is related;17correct?18AIt's the same call.1920AIt's the call that goes to a voicemail; right?The first one?21MR. CONROY: Objection.222324THE COURT: Overruled.Q 26191 is a missed call that goes to a voicemail,reflected in 26192; correct?25A That's not my understanding.Laurie Eisenberg, CSR, RPRSenior Court Reporter

J. Jarmel-Schneider Cross/Bove32291Were you here this morning when Mr. Dixon testified?2AYeah.3Can I explain?4I'm just going to ask you some questions.5AYes, I understand.७You can be questioned again by Mr. Conroy.You were here when he testified; correct?78AYes.910right.I asked him some questions on the feature call on the11AYes.12You see where it says "VM"?13AYes.14For voicemail?15AYes.16That's the way he explained it; correct?17AYes.18That's what he said?19AYes.20QSo, this call, thenthe call reflected in 26192,21according to Mr. Dixon's testimony, reflects a voicemail; does22it not?23AIf that's what he said.24HI don't want to testify to something I'm not an expert25in.Laurie Eisenberg, CSR, RPRSenior Court Reporter

J. Jarmel-SchneiderCross/Bove323012right?3AYes.45But, you were here when he said VM means voicemail;७78MR. BOVE: If we could zoom out, please. Just toget oriented.(Whereupon, an exhibit is shown on the screens.)Q The three columns there, the right side there's afield that says IMEI; right?9AYes.10111213MR. BOVE: If we could zoom in on the IMEI columnof this whole page, please.Q You were here when Mr. Dixon said the IMEI is thenumber associated with the physical device itself; right?14AYes.1516I think you're blowing up the wrong column, but that is myunderstanding also.17Sorry.18Thank you.19Do we have the IMEI up now?20AYes.2122So, you were here when Mr. Dixon said this IMEI numberis the number associated with the physical device itself;23right?24AYes.25So, this IMEI associated with the two calls, theLaurie Eisenberg, CSR, RPRSenior Court Reporter

J. Jarmel-SchneiderCross/Bove32311missed call and the voicemail that we just talked about, ends24913; right?3AThat's correct.45You just reminded us, did you not, that the IMEIassociated with the CP1 phone ends 4731?6AThat's correct.78A91010A1112A13So, it's a different device; right?That's right.So, it's a voicemail; correct?If you say so.Well, it's "VM"?Yes.You were here when Mr. Dixon said it; right?14AYes.1516171819202122Q So, it's a voicemail to a different physical devicethan the one Mr. Daus testified about; right?A To a different physical device, yes.MR. BOVE: Nothing further, Judge.THE COURT: Thank you.Any redirect?MR. CONROY: Just a few questions.REDIRECT EXAMINATION23BY MR. CONROY:24Q I just want to talk, first, about the summary charts25that you did.Laurie Eisenberg, CSR, RPRSenior Court Reporter

J. Jarmel-Schneider-Redirect/Conroy3232All of the calls on those charts are in evidence in otherplaces; is that right?123AYes.4Does that include the calls that Mr. Bove was talking5 about that when we cut down on the charts, those calls are all16still in evidence; correct?7AYes.Why, if you know if you know, why were those89 exhibits shortened?10AMy understanding is that the decision was always going1112to be that we would admit the parts of the call summaries thatwere related to what had come out in trial. That's the point of13doing summary charts.1415We're pretty far down the road now, so we made decisionsabout which parts of them to include.16And you were asked a couple of questions about the17fact that you knew that the charts--the original summary18charts had been turned over to the Defense; is that right?19AYes.20And you know that the new versions had also been2122A2324turned over to the Defense; right?That's correct.And were you aware that there was no objection tothose charts coming into evidence?25AYes.Laurie Eisenberg, CSR, RPRSenior Court Reporter

J. Jarmel-Schneider-Redirect/Conroy323312345७78910MR. CONROY: If we could pull up what we werejust looking at, the page from People's 400 with the Batesending 2726.(Whereupon, an exhibit is shown on the screens.)MR. CONROY: If we could pull up the same twolines we were just looking at, 26191 and 92.(Whereupon, an exhibit is shown on the screens.)I believe, earlier, or just a minute or two ago oncross-examination, there was something you wanted to explainabout what you saw in this call that interrupted the call11that's in evidence as 246.12Can you explain that for us?13ASure.14So, Mr. Bove--Bove--sorry--asked me if these were two151617181920212223related calls and if the first one was a missed call.My understanding is this was one call that had two legs.I'm not sure exactly where it went. But, this is how AT&Treported a single call that hit multiple stop points throughtheir system before being connected.That was the clarification.Okay.If you know, do people sometimes get new phones and keepthe same phone number?24AI do.25Meaning, you do get a new phone and keep the sameLaurie Eisenberg, CSR, RPRSenior Court Reporter

J. Jarmel-Schneider-Recross/Bove1phone number?2AYes.3MR. CONROY:I have nothing further.4Thank you.51673234THE COURT: Mr. Bove?MR. BOVE: Yes.Just briefly.If we could just bring that back up on the(Whereupon, an exhibit is shown on the screens.)RECROSS-EXAMINATIONBY MR. BOVE:The significance of this call is that the recordingfrom the phone CP1 cut off; right?ACuts off mid-conversation; correct?89screen.101112131415Correct.1617181920A2122232425AI don't know if it cut off mid-conversation or at theend of the conversation.It cuts off at some point in the conversation; right?It ends.Right.And it ends before the President is done speaking toMr. Cohen; correct?MR. CONROY: Objection.THE COURT: Sustained.Laurie Eisenberg, CSR, RPRSenior Court Reporter

J. Jarmel-Schneider-Recross/Bove32351You just gave, essentially, what is a hypothesis about2these two calls on the screens; right?3A I am just describing the timestamps on the calls.4But, you're not accounting for what's on the right5 side that says voicemail?७AI don't think that's true.78I mean,9101112131415I apologize. I don't think I'm not accounting for it.the significance of the call is the timestamp.Well, that's part of the significance.The other part is whether or not the phone call wasactually answered.A Not necessarily.I'm not sure if the recording would have actually cut offwhether it was answered or not. Could have been it just camein, cut off automatically. I don't know.16Right.17You were here during Mr. Daus' testimony; correct?18AYes.192021You were here when I asked him: You could not do anyforensic analysis to determine the interplay between anincoming call and the voice recording data; right?22MR. CONROY:Objection.232425THE COURT:Sustained.You are aware the recording cuts off, and that's whyyou were looking for a toll like this?Laurie Eisenberg, CSR, RPRSenior Court Reporter

J. Jarmel-Schneider-Recross/Bove1AYes.2MR. BOVE:Nothing further.3THE COURT:Anything else?4MR. CONROY:Nothing further.OT51678169101112131415161718192021222324253236THE COURT: Thank you, sir.You can step down.(Whereupon, the witness is excused.)THE COURT: People, is that it for today?MR. STEINGLASS:Yes, Judge.THE COURT: All right.Jurors, we're going to stop at this time.Before I excuse you, I am required to give youthese admonitions:I remind you to please not talk either amongyourselves or with anyone else about anything related tothe case.Please continue to keep an open mind.Do not form or express an opinion about thedefendant's guilt or innocence until all the evidence isin, I have given my final instructions on the law, and Ihave directed you to begin deliberations.Do not request, accept, agree to accept ordiscuss with any person the receipt or acceptance of anybenefit or payment in return for supplying informationconcerning the trial.Laurie Eisenberg, CSR, RPRSenior Court Reporter

12345७789101112131415161718192021222324Proceedings(Whereupon, the Defense confers.)THE COURT: Are you done?MR. BOVE:Sorry.3237THE COURT:Report directly to me any incidentwithin your knowledge or attempt by anyone to improperlyinfluence you or any member of the jury.Do not visit or view any of the locationsdiscussed in the testimony.Do not use any program or electronic device tosearch for and view any location discussed in thetestimony.Do not read, nor listen to any accounts ordiscussions related to the case. That includes the readingor the listening to the reading of any transcripts in thetrial or the reading of posts on any court sites.Do not attempt to research any fact, issue or lawrelated to the case.Do not communicate with anyone about the case byany means, including by telephone, text messages,telephone, or the internet.Do not Google or search for any information aboutthe case, the law which applies to the case, or the peopleinvolved in the case.Have a good weekend.See you Monday at 9:30.25Laurie Eisenberg, CSR, RPRSenior Court Reporter

123Sti45וס678910111213141516171819202122232425Proceedings3238COURT OFFICER: All rise.(Whereupon, the jurors and the alternate jurorsare excused.)THE COURT: Please be seated.Mr. Blanche, I was going to ask the People if Icould have a copy of People's 350. I think it would behelpful to the Court in preparing the jury charges.I wanted to ask if there's any objection to myreceiving that now.MR. BLANCHE: May I just have one moment?THE COURT: Sure.(Whereupon, the Defense confers.)THE COURT: Was that the number of the documentchart, 350?wasMR. CONROY: Yes, Judge.(Whereupon, the Defense confers).MR. BLANCHE: Your Honor, we're fine with that.THE COURT: Okay.MR. BLANCHE: On the same topic, our intentionto submit it to the Court, as the Court might havesome proposed charges as well.There's certainly no objection to the Courtreviewing that.THE COURT: Thank you. I appreciate that.That was going to be my next thing.Laurie Eisenberg, CSR, RPRSenior Court Reporter

1234516Proceedings3239You should feel free to start submitting anyspecial instructions that you want.We will definitely have a pre-charge conferenceat the appropriate time. I will make my final decisionsthen.You can start bringing matters to my attentionif you like.Tell me about scheduling for next week.MR. STEINGLASS: Um, we expect to callTHE COURT: Two witnesses?MR. STEINGLASS: Yes.Potentially, two witnesses; and I think it'sentirely possible that we will rest by the end of next7now,891011121314week.1516171819202122232425THE COURT: Okay. All right.MR. STEINGLASS: Also, there was one otherevidentiary matter that Mr. Conroy wanted to raise withthe Court if this is a good time.THE COURT: Sure. It is.MR. CONROY: This relates to an exhibit numbered.People's 79, which is a copy of a Severance Agreement forAllen Weisselberg.We've had, I think, some conversation withCounsel about this.My understanding but I'm sure they'll let meLaurie Eisenberg, CSR, RPRSenior Court Reporter

Proceedings32401know if I'm wrong--is that while they object to it23coming into evidence, if your Honor finds it admissible,they will not we will not need to call a witness to put4it in.5167Is that accurate?It's sort of a relevance objection.MR. BOVE:Right.We just want to resolve our other legalobjections.It will come in authenticity-wise subject to theCourt's ruling.THE COURT: Can I take a look at it?MR. CONROY: Sure.Actually, your Honor, I'll hand up a copy of thechart that's in evidence as 350 with that, as well.THE COURT:Thank you.(Whereupon, the People give the Court documents.)THE COURT: Mr. Bove, what's your objection?MR. BOVE: Judge, this is the SeparationAgreement between The Trump Organization andMr. Weisselberg.Mr. Weisselberg's absence from this trial is avery complicated issue.I wouldn't be surprised if there ends up being afoundation for a missing witness instruction about the8910111213141516171819202122232425Laurie Eisenberg, CSR, RPRSenior Court Reporter

Proceedingsuncalled witnesses being equally unavailable to both12sides.3241345७789101112131415His posture in this trial is as a hearsaydeclarant, which the Government is using, basically, inthat capacity as a witness.Their theory is he conspired, I think, withMr. Cohen; that he gave instructions to Mr. McConney.He is in that way, I submit, an uncalledGovernment witness.To offer this Agreement, which I think would beoffered as a way to sort of impeach their own hearsaydeclarant and suggest there's some kind of bias and motivethat he has to either not be here or acting in a certainway, raises a number of complexities in light ofMr. Weisselberg's overall situation.16We think it's unduly prejudicial.17And it's not particularly relevant, especially in18a situation where they are offeringwhere the192021222324Government is offering his statements.I think this would look differently if we hadsought to offer hearsay from him.That's not what we were doing.THE COURT: So, it's a hearsay objection?MR. BOVE: Not quite.25Because, as I said, just to make sure,there's noLaurie Eisenberg, CSR, RPRSenior Court Reporter

12345७Proceedings3242business records hearsay objection.If your Honor overrules this right now, we'regoing to stipulate.78910111213141516171819202122232425Our objection is to relevance and undueprejudice.We don't think it's relevant that he entered intothis Agreement after-the-fact.And we think it's unduly prejudicial andconfusing in light of the fact that Mr. Weisselberg is inprison right now and not available to anyone.THE COURT: So, I understand the relevance of theobjection.Help me understand the undue prejudice objectiona little bit more.MR. BOVE: As a result of Mr. Weisselberg's legalsituation, I think that he would, likelytried to call him, he would, likely, invoke.if either sideWe are not able to elicit testimony because ofthose circ*mstances. We're not able to elicit testimonythat would, potentially, impeach some of the hearsay thathas been offered.And I think the Government is probably in asimilar situation.He is, in effect, their witness at this trial asa hearsay declarant.Laurie Eisenberg, CSR, RPRSenior Court Reporter

Proceedings324312In that way, we don't think the Government isable to impeach their own hearsay declarant, even in this34form of impeachment, that he entered into a SettlementAgreement after-the-fact, based on a host of situations51678910that we don't think is relevant at this trial.We think those two considerations require thatthis not come in because of the confusion it would add.THE COURT:People?MR. CONROY:Thanks.Judge, as the Court is aware, there11has been--there probably will be more discussion of12Mr. Weisselberg and various things related to him in the13141516171819202122232425case.And what we are looking to do is explain, fromour perspective, why he's not here.I am sure there will be arguments made by Counselabout whether he should have been here and what not beinghere means.I think we need this Agreement.Our view is that Mr. Weisselberg's interestsright now are very aligned with the Defendant's. I thinkthis Agreement points that out.Among other things, there are three payments dueMr. Weisselberg during this calendar year for $250,000each; one in June, one in September, and one in December.Laurie Eisenberg, CSR, RPRSenior Court Reporter

12345७7891011Proceedings3244Also, if you take a look at the Agreement,particularly in Section 3, Employee Promises, in 3 (B): Theemployee promises not to verbally or in writing disparage,criticize or denigrate the company or any of its currentor former entities, directors, managers, employees, ownersor representatives.In Sub D, under 3: The employee promises that,except for acts or testimony directly compelled bysubpoena or other lawful process issued by a court ofcompetent jurisdiction, he will not communicate with,provide information to or otherwise cooperate in any waywith any other with any other person or entity,including his counsel or other agents having or claimingto have any adverse claims against the company, or anyperson or entity released by this Agreement with regard tothe adverse claims, or to take any action to induce,encourage, instigate, aid, abet, or otherwise cause anyperson or entity to bring or file a complaint, charge,lawsuit or other proceeding of any kind against thecompany or any person or entity released by thisAgreement.Those are just a couple of the provisions.And Counsel referred to trying to impeach hiscredibility.We're not trying to do that.1213141516171819202122232425Laurie Eisenberg, CSR, RPRSenior Court Reporter

12345७Proceedings3245What we're trying to do is explain his absence.I think, or I would submit, that this Agreementoffers a real explanation for why he is not going to behere in this trial.that.MR. BOVE: We just, respectfully, disagree withThis Agreement is not the reason thatMr. Weisselberg is not at this trial.Jeff McConney has a substantial similar Agreementthat is in evidence, but he testified at this trial. Andhis availability or lack thereof is much morestraight-forward, has similar terms.Nobody tried to invoke that Agreement to preventhim from testifying.That's just not the case. That's not the reasonMr. Weisselberg is not here.The reason Mr. Weisselberg is not a witness toeither side is because the District Attorney's Officeinitiated a perjury prosecution in the lead-up to this78910111213141516171819202122232425case.Even that sentence, I know, is a very complicatedsentence, Judge.My point is, to get into any of this, it wouldall have to come out.It's just a rabbit hole that I think isLaurie Eisenberg, CSR, RPRSenior Court Reporter

Proceedings324612345167891011121314unnecessary for and it is being offered to impeachMr. Weisselberg.It's being offered to show a bias and a motivethat the Government's own hearsay declarant, they'resaying, has.It's a much more complicated situation than that.For those reasons, we don't think it's relevant.And if it is, it should not come in because ofthe prejudice.MR. CONROY: Very quickly, Judge, with respect toMr. McConney, I believe he's gotten all of his payments,and his Agreement has sort of ended.The other thing I would say is, if Counselprefers, we would be willing to stipulate thatMr. Weisselberg is in jail for perjury if that solves theproblem.THE COURT: I think that that would be one way tosolve the problem.My question is, has anyone attempted to get him15161718192021or22MR. CONROY:2324THE COURT: And have you?You have an obligation.25MR. BOVE:No.to come in in some way, by serving him with a subpoenain other words, try to compel his testimony?Judge, the People have not.Laurie Eisenberg, CSR, RPRSenior Court Reporter

12345७Proceedings3247THE COURT: You referred to how "both sides" arehaving difficulty with this issue.MR. BOVE: If I said it that way, I mis mypoint is, I think there's an equally shared access issue.They have chosen to call or not call him.We, obviously, have no burden here.We have not taken steps to try and call him at78this trial.9It's just--it would not resolve the situation101112131415161718if we stipulated that he was in prison for perjury.I think it actually further supports mypoint, which is, there are a host of reasons thatMr. Weisselberg is not going to be a witness in this case.They, the Government, have chosen to not takesteps to call him.It's a very complicated situation.It's not completely explained by this document.It would be misleading to allow this document in19by itself.20It would be further prejudicialI'm not2122232425suggesting your Honor is requiring for us to stipulatefor us to stipulate to some negotiated statement about theperjury situation.And we think that all of this is sort of asideshow for somebody that is the Government's hearsayLaurie Eisenberg, CSR, RPRSenior Court Reporter

Proceedings3248declarant, who they shouldn't be permitted to impeach in12the first place.3MR. CONROY: The last thing451678910111213141516171819202122232425hopefully the lastthing, it's not that it's the reason, but it's a reason,and it's a significant reason that helps explain why he'snot here.THE COURT: I think it would be helpful to memaking my decision if I could see that some efforts weretaken to compel his appearance.I don't have to do this right now; right?MR. CONROY: No.THE COURT: Let me think about it.Right now, it seems to me that we're kind oftrying to jump the gun.We want to explain why he's not here, withouthaving made every effort to get him here.Section 3 (C)actually, it's 3 (D), it says:Except for acts or testimony directly compelled bysubpoena or other lawful process issued by a court ofcompetent jurisdiction.It seems to me, if I'm understanding correctly,that that step has not yet been taken. Not that it has tobe taken.It's a factor for me in making this decision.MR. STEINGLASS:Can I just say one thing onLaurie Eisenberg, CSR, RPRSenior Court Reporter

Proceedings32491that, Judge?2THE COURT:3MR.Sure.STEINGLASS:45७While it's true that we couldsubpoena him and put him up there cold, the Agreementseems to preclude us from talking to him or him talking tous at the risk of losing $750,000 of outstanding severanceSo, while it is, theoretically, our prerogativeto try to subpoena him, put him up, and see if he wouldtake the Fifth Amendment in real-time, but do this cold,7pay.891011is a1213141516171819it'sI don't think is really the entire point. Even ifeven if it's relevant, I don't think it's theentire point.I think that that Agreement has a very palpableconnection to why that could be an exercise in futility ora strategically bad decision, to put a witness on thestand who is under an Agreement like that.THE COURT:Right.I think one way to possibly deal with that is todo it out of the presence of the jury and put him on thestand.He can have counsel present.202122232425go through the steps that are required for me to find thatHe can be asked a few questions, and he can say,"I'm not going to answer the questions," and then we canLaurie Eisenberg, CSR, RPRSenior Court Reporter

123451678910Proceedings3250he's either unavailable or unwilling to testify.MR. STEINGLASS: We could do that, Judge, butthen we would still be under the situation of calling thewitness to the stand who's under no obligation with us.THE COURT: Right.Then it would be on the record and I've seen it.MR. STEINGLASS: Right.THE COURT: Right now, we're speculating. We'respeculating he would honor an Agreement. We'respeculating the degree to which this Agreement dictates hecould not speak to you. We're speculating to the advice hemay or may not be given by counsel.It's difficult to rule like that.MR. BOVE: I want to make one last point, becausewe're contemplating a lot of process around this.Mr. Weisselberg has never been on theGovernment's witness list.So, to suddenly try and create this procedure toI think we were--get around a way to admit this documentprocedurally barred this morning from offering an exhibit.I think there are procedural problems with tryingto add him to the witness list at this point, as well.THE COURT: I don't see what one thing has to dowith the other.We're not creating any procedure.111213141516171819202122232425Laurie Eisenberg, CSR, RPRSenior Court Reporter

12345७Proceedings3251This is done. This is done with some frequency.I've had people produced from jail testify. I'vehad other people, who were unwilling to, testify.But, the only way to know that is to put them onthe stand, out of the presence of the jury, on the record,under oath.MR. BOVE: My point is slightly different, isthat even if Mr. Weisselberg came to this trial and wasnow willing to testify for any number of reasons he mightdecide to, we were entitled to notice of that long beforethis trial started.That's the point I was making.THE COURT: Did you think there was a possibilitythat at some point the People might call Allen Weisselbergto testify?MR. BOVE: Not based on the witness list, no.THE COURT: Is there anything else?MR. STEINGLASS: No, thank you.MR. BLANCHE: Your Honor, we have an applicationwith respect to Mr. Cohen.It's we've been pushing the Court, at the riskof stating the obvious, regarding the Gag Order.Mr. Cohen continues to speak publicly about thistrial and about President Trump.As recently as, I believe, Wednesday night, he78910111213141516171819202122232425Laurie Eisenberg, CSR, RPRSenior Court Reporter

Proceedings32521was on TikTok, this time talking extensively abouthe2was wearing a white T-shirt with a picture of President34516Trump behind bars, wearing an orange jumpsuit, anddiscussing about how he's now announcing he's running forCongress.Our request is, now that we have one week left inthe trial, that he be prohibited from talking. The sameway President Trump is.The case law speaks to your Honor having thepower to do this.Sheppard v. Maxwell explicitly states: There maybe instances where the Court not only needs to stopextrajudicial statements from the parties and the lawyers,but also from the witnesses or court officials.Your Honor, it's Friday. We have a couple of days78910111213141516left.171819202122232425It's now becoming it's becoming a problemevery single day that President Trump is not allowed torespond to this witness, but this witness is allowed tocontinue to talk.He has stated on social media that he's going tostop talking a couple of different times, and he doesn't.So,our request is that the Court order--orderthe Government to instruct the witness to not talk aboutPresident Trump or--or this case until the case is over.Laurie Eisenberg, CSR, RPRSenior Court Reporter

1234516Proceedings3253THE COURT: Mr. Steinglass?MR. STEINGLASS:Judge, we have repeatedlyinstructed all of the witnesses in this case, to theextent that we have any control over it, to refrain frommaking public statements.The fact of the matter is, we have no control78over what they do. We have repeatedly, repeatedly askedthe witnesses not to do that. Not just Mr. Cohen. All the910witnesses.The fact of the matter is, these witnesses arenot subject to the Gag Order, and we have no remedy if1112they engage in those activities.13So, all we can do--if the Court isif1415161718Mr. Blanche is asking the Court to order the People toorder the witnesses not to do something, we have alreadydone that. Or, to the extent that we have already asked,we have no power to order.And, there's nothing, really, more to say about19that.202122232425THE COURT: It might be a little bit of a newanswer, but I would direct the People to communicate toMr. Cohen that the judge is asking him to refrain frommaking any more statements about this case, aboutMr. Trump, or about anything related to this case or theprocess; that that comes from the Bench and that you areLaurie Eisenberg, CSR, RPRSenior Court Reporter

12345७Proceedings3254communicating that on behalf of the Bench.MR. STEINGLASS: We will do so.Thank you.MR. BLANCHE:Thank you, your Honor.THE COURT: Thank you.I'll see you Monday.(Whereupon, the case is adjourned to 5-13-2024 at789:30 AM.)910111213141516171819202122232425Laurie Eisenberg, CSR, RPRSenior Court Reporter